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all right

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come Blast Off In My Time Machine sir I

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feel like an evizing Blast Off Blast Off

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Blast Off blast off come blast off in my

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Blast Off on another epic episode of

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hero paranormal podcast the hyper

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anomalous esoteric research organization

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podcast

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is broadcasting from the base at la

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Madre Mountain just south of area 51. my

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name is Ryan the anomalous ambassador of

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the airwaves bringing you an epic

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episode today if you want more epic

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content that lies behind the paywall

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please subscribe to Hero paranormal on

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patreon or go to heroparanormal.com on

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podbean and you can get all that content

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behind the paywall

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on today's episode we have one of my

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favorite authors of all time in fact

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he's in the top three if not my favorite

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Robert Guffey is an author and

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researcher as well as a professor and

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lecturer in the department of English at

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California State University at Long

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Beach Robert has an amazing website

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which definitely must be checked out it

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c-r-y-p-t-o-s-c-a-t-o-l-o-g-y dot

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blogspot.com definitely check that out

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he is the author of a bunch of books

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including Camelio crypto scatology

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conspiracy theory as an art form spies

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and saucers until the last dog dies

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Bella lugosi's dead Widow of the

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amputation and other weird crimes Bella

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lugosi's and the monogram 9 and

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operation mindfuck to name a few we are

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going to dive deep into camellio and

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others Camellia is a strange but true

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story of invisible spies heroin

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addiction and Homeland Security and was

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called by Flavor Wire by many miles the

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weirdest and funniest book of the year

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when it was published I couldn't agree

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more Robert is brilliant he is a

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graduate of the famed Clarion Writers

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Workshop in Seattle and he has written

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for numerous Publications more than I

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can mention when it comes to camellio

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and the optical camouflage technology

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mentioned within its Pages particular

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companies with defense contracts come up

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it has been theorized by George Knapp

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colem Kelleher and many others that some

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of the highly strange events in the uena

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Basin may be of man-made descent and

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this phenomenal Tech often called an

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invisibility suit or cloak would Square

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really fall under the umbrella of some

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of this High strangeness Robert Guffey

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for having me on

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there's so many questions I have and so

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many places we can go but let's start at

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the beginning which is this amazing

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series of events not to mention uh

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I I think it's very divinely or

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coincidental synchronicity whatever you

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want to call it and and we find this

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oftentimes in the pages of books such as

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John Keels with the Mothman Prophecies

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but this all squarely kind of ties up

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towards the end in ways that nobody

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would have imagined with uh your

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connection to Freemasonry I'm also

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involved with the great work and I think

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it's very awesome how you just come

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right out and say it early on in the

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book to get that out of the way but

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because of that things kind of navigate

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interestingly

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um with how you met Richard the inventor

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of this technology but I don't want to

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get ahead of myself

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could we tell listeners a little bit

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about camellio and how you came to write

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this book

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well absolutely

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um uh by the way the uh a tunnel Equinox

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which was on the 22nd uh would have been

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uh Richard's birthday uh Richard

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schoengert uh the inventor uh featured

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so prominently in camellia uh which

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we'll discuss uh

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in a second

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um Richard passed away uh on Christmas

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Eve morning uh last year but um uh for

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for me the whole Camellia story started

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on

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uh in July of 2003

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and I was living in Torrance California

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and my friend Damian who I'd known since

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I was 16. uh he was living in uh San

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Diego in the Pacific Beach area

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and uh

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I I remember the specific date it was

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July 12 2003 because that was the day I

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was initiated in into the third degree a

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free masonry uh and I called

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Damien right afterwards to tell him that

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I you know had not been sacrificed to

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Baphomet or anything like that and I

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expect him to answer the phone he didn't

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you know I left a message normally he

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would get back to me pretty quickly

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um in this case several days went by and

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I was starting to get a little worried

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then a whole week went by and finally he

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calls me and he tells me this incredible

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story that uh

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at that time he was living in this

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apartment in Pacific Beach which was

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kind of a party house so people were

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coming in and out all the time and this

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he meets this kid named Lee or Doyle his

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name changes depending on who you ask uh

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and I I call it Damien I call him Dion

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in the book but his real name's Damien

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uh Damien said to this kid well you know

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you can just crash on my couch which

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wasn't an unusual experience uh for him

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at that time

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people were coming in and out all the

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time uh so the kid crashes on Damien's

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couch

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and then a couple days later Damien has

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this party

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uh and all kinds of illicit substances

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are being used of course and uh this kid

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in the middle of all this chaos uh pulls

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out this laptop

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and a DOD symbol appears on the screen

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now udamian up until that moment wasn't

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uh aware that this kid had gone AWOL

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from Camp Pendleton uh the nearby Marine

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base and he had stolen

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um a nine millimeter Iraqi gun taken off

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the body of a dead Iraqi General over

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two dozen pairs of high-tech night

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vision goggles the dod laptop a computer

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and an entire truck

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and um sometimes people

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will be very skeptical of that and say

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it's not possible that he could have

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stolen a truck and all that other stuff

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from the base but

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I don't know what to tell you because he

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did and also even before that point just

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a couple of years before 2003 there was

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a case where a guy stole a whole tank

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from the Armory and drove it right down

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the middle of San Diego just through the

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freeway uh a crushing fire hydrants and

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RVs and cars and ended up in the middle

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of the freeway stuck and the police

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swarmed over it you can see the footage

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you know just put in like San Diego tank

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uh you'll find the the footage the cops

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just you know they're pushing themselves

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out of the way so they could be the

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first to to shoot the guy

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uh in the head which they did

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um and I talked about there's a whole

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documentary about that called cul-de-sac

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which actually weirdly ties in with

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Camellia and I actually briefly

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mentioned the cul-de-sac documentary in

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in the pages of camellia but anyway that

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guy stole tank in this case this kid

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stole a truck and all this other stuff

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he ends up at Damien's house through

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sheer coincidence I assume uh and so

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here he is at this party that Damian's

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throwing he whips out the dod laptop

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computer Damon immediately sees the dod

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symbol and says hey you got to get that

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get this little jack out of here uh

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and the the kid says oh don't worry they

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can't they can't track this

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uh within minutes of him saying that

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there's a knock at the door

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um it's a it's a woman who in the book I

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call Lita Johnson though that's not her

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real name she identified herself as a

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special agent for the NCIS

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and this this was before even like the

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NCIS television series and all that uh

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and and uh she appears at the door

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identifies herself as NCIS she's got two

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like men in black looking goons behind

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her uh she wants to search the apartment

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Damien who is the son of a Narcotics cop

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and and knew his rights immediately said

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no uh you can't uh come in uh unless you

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have a warrant and she said well I'll be

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right back so Damien slams the door on

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her face he turns to everyone at the

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party and says okay grab your

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meaning grab your drugs that you're

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doing and and get out go go out the back

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they all

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sensing the heat is near they

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immediately toss all their drugs on

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dammy's apartment and run out the back

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door

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uh the kid is still there

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um within a very short span of time

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after that the NCIS return and also the

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San Diego Police Department so Damien

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said that it didn't seem as if they were

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working together they were really

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bumping heads he said it was like the

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Keystone Cops

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and they didn't care at all about any of

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the drugs on the carpet they were hyper

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focused on these night vision goggles

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supposedly this kid Lee slashed oil

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stole from the military base and and uh

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they refused Damien's like I look I just

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met this kid I don't know anything about

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him you just sleeping on the couch they

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didn't believe that at all and so they

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arrest

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them both down to the San Diego jail and

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they give Damian the Abu grape treatment

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for

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an entire week

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um and it's very you know kafka-esque

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scenario because here they are drilling

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him with questions Damien's like I don't

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know anything but no you must know

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something they had assumed that Damien

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and this kid Were Somehow in League with

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each other and they were going to sell

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the stolen military equipment to Al

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Qaeda or some you know foreign terrorist

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organization Damien's I just Damian just

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keeps saying look I just met this kid

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I don't even know his real name I just

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met him a couple of days ago and uh uh

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it took a long time and also I should

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point out Damien's been in and out of

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jail uh his whole life he he was

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he he was on the same cell block as uh

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the Menendez brothers

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and OJ in LA and he was also uh in a

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jail in Maryland when Mike Tyson was

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there

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Damian was working in the library and he

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would check out books to to Mike Tyson

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since Damien's the son of a cop they

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would often put him in the protected

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whenever he was in jail they put him in

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the protected

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Excel block with like the celebrities

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like people inmates whose lives were in

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danger uh so since he was the son of a

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cop he was considered to be that his

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life was in danger from other inmates so

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they would put him they figured off and

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end up going to sell with these

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celebrities uh anyway he's been out of

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jail his whole life he's been homeless

273
00:12:37,790 --> 00:12:36,540
on the street he doesn't like cops it

274
00:12:39,550 --> 00:12:37,800
probably has something to do with the

275
00:12:44,389 --> 00:12:39,560
fact that his dad was a cop

276
00:12:46,790 --> 00:12:44,399
uh and so you know he was not in any way

277
00:12:49,129 --> 00:12:46,800
going to be cooperative even if he had

278
00:12:50,690 --> 00:12:49,139
known anything even if he had known what

279
00:12:52,610 --> 00:12:50,700
the kid had done or what the kid was

280
00:12:54,230 --> 00:12:52,620
intending to do with the stolen

281
00:12:57,530 --> 00:12:54,240
equipment Damian probably would not have

282
00:12:59,449 --> 00:12:57,540
cooperated anyway but in this case he

283
00:13:00,829 --> 00:12:59,459
really didn't know anything about the

284
00:13:03,050 --> 00:13:00,839
situation

285
00:13:04,430 --> 00:13:03,060
after a week goes by they finally they

286
00:13:07,790 --> 00:13:04,440
let him go

287
00:13:10,910 --> 00:13:07,800
he goes back home he calls me

288
00:13:12,949 --> 00:13:10,920
uh and I'm the first person he calls and

289
00:13:15,410 --> 00:13:12,959
he tells me this whole story and we

290
00:13:18,230 --> 00:13:15,420
think wow that's weird you know it can't

291
00:13:19,790 --> 00:13:18,240
get weirder than that uh obviously they

292
00:13:21,350 --> 00:13:19,800
figured out that you didn't know

293
00:13:23,629 --> 00:13:21,360
anything they came through their senses

294
00:13:25,550 --> 00:13:23,639
they let you go and that's the end of it

295
00:13:28,009 --> 00:13:25,560
uh

296
00:13:30,650 --> 00:13:28,019
Damien calls me back a few days later to

297
00:13:32,870 --> 00:13:30,660
tell me that he's being followed all

298
00:13:35,629 --> 00:13:32,880
around the Pacific Beach area by what he

299
00:13:38,150 --> 00:13:35,639
described as Jarhead looking dudes and

300
00:13:40,550 --> 00:13:38,160
at first I thought he meant like covert

301
00:13:43,129 --> 00:13:40,560
surveillance like one or two people

302
00:13:45,769 --> 00:13:43,139
following him around

303
00:13:47,930 --> 00:13:45,779
um no he says that it's like a whole

304
00:13:49,490 --> 00:13:47,940
parade of people and they weren't even

305
00:13:51,470 --> 00:13:49,500
being covert about it they were being

306
00:13:53,569 --> 00:13:51,480
overt about it as if they were going out

307
00:13:55,790 --> 00:13:53,579
of their way to make

308
00:13:58,730 --> 00:13:55,800
make sure that Damien could see them

309
00:14:01,430 --> 00:13:58,740
following him he'd go into a 7-Eleven on

310
00:14:03,410 --> 00:14:01,440
Garnett Avenue they'd follow him right

311
00:14:05,750 --> 00:14:03,420
in and then follow him right out again

312
00:14:07,790 --> 00:14:05,760
he'd go to his favorite Mexican

313
00:14:10,069 --> 00:14:07,800
restaurant there in Pacific Beach and

314
00:14:13,310 --> 00:14:10,079
they would all sit in the tables and the

315
00:14:14,569 --> 00:14:13,320
booths around him and stare at him uh

316
00:14:15,769 --> 00:14:14,579
but this was something that if anyone

317
00:14:17,269 --> 00:14:15,779
else walked in they wouldn't notice

318
00:14:19,629 --> 00:14:17,279
anything out of the ordinary just seemed

319
00:14:22,490 --> 00:14:19,639
like the place is packed you know

320
00:14:24,710 --> 00:14:22,500
uh then he says they're they're parking

321
00:14:26,629 --> 00:14:24,720
their cars outside his apartment they're

322
00:14:28,670 --> 00:14:26,639
shining his halogen lights through his

323
00:14:30,230 --> 00:14:28,680
windows at two in the morning they're

324
00:14:33,829 --> 00:14:30,240
flicking their headlights on their cars

325
00:14:35,870 --> 00:14:33,839
through his bedroom window uh all night

326
00:14:38,090 --> 00:14:35,880
um honked their horns so you know to

327
00:14:40,550 --> 00:14:38,100
wake him up in the middle of the night

328
00:14:42,949 --> 00:14:40,560
they post people outside his window like

329
00:14:45,949 --> 00:14:42,959
where his kitchen was uh and just have

330
00:14:47,930 --> 00:14:45,959
them talk to each other about him and

331
00:14:49,610 --> 00:14:47,940
he's describing all this I'm thinking is

332
00:14:52,550 --> 00:14:49,620
Damian and undergoing some sort of like

333
00:14:56,230 --> 00:14:52,560
meth-induced paranoia I had never

334
00:15:00,530 --> 00:14:56,240
seen that occur to him before this point

335
00:15:02,269 --> 00:15:00,540
but he was a drug user so I thought his

336
00:15:06,410 --> 00:15:02,279
his drug of choice was heroin by the way

337
00:15:09,170 --> 00:15:06,420
which which is not a hallucinogen uh but

338
00:15:11,329 --> 00:15:09,180
I thought okay well maybe he's having

339
00:15:13,430 --> 00:15:11,339
some sort of meth induced paranoia maybe

340
00:15:16,250 --> 00:15:13,440
that's what's going on so I was

341
00:15:18,290 --> 00:15:16,260
skeptical at first and I said look why

342
00:15:20,689 --> 00:15:18,300
don't you take photos of these cars or

343
00:15:21,949 --> 00:15:20,699
supposedly following you around you say

344
00:15:23,870 --> 00:15:21,959
that they're following you everywhere

345
00:15:25,370 --> 00:15:23,880
you know get photos of all of the

346
00:15:26,930 --> 00:15:25,380
license plates or they're parked right

347
00:15:28,610 --> 00:15:26,940
outside your house just walk up and

348
00:15:29,870 --> 00:15:28,620
photograph them write down the license

349
00:15:32,210 --> 00:15:29,880
plate number

350
00:15:35,090 --> 00:15:32,220
so he does that he sends me a whole list

351
00:15:36,530 --> 00:15:35,100
of these license plate numbers and uh I

352
00:15:40,370 --> 00:15:36,540
happen to have a friend who worked at

353
00:15:42,710 --> 00:15:40,380
the DMV up in uh Washington State so I

354
00:15:45,949 --> 00:15:42,720
sent him the list of license plate

355
00:15:48,410 --> 00:15:45,959
numbers and the every single one of them

356
00:15:50,750 --> 00:15:48,420
came back and the list is in the book by

357
00:15:52,129 --> 00:15:50,760
the way it's in camellia every single

358
00:15:54,650 --> 00:15:52,139
one of them came back is officially

359
00:15:57,170 --> 00:15:54,660
non-existent which made no sense to me

360
00:15:59,449 --> 00:15:57,180
if he was suffering from paranoia they

361
00:16:02,329 --> 00:15:59,459
would have come up as just neighbors who

362
00:16:03,650 --> 00:16:02,339
lived in the area other people lived in

363
00:16:05,949 --> 00:16:03,660
Pacific Beach

364
00:16:08,870 --> 00:16:05,959
instead they're all officially

365
00:16:10,490 --> 00:16:08,880
non-existent even if Damien was just

366
00:16:12,949 --> 00:16:10,500
making up random license plate numbers

367
00:16:15,170 --> 00:16:12,959
you'd think you'd hit

368
00:16:17,090 --> 00:16:15,180
real license plate numbers you know and

369
00:16:19,430 --> 00:16:17,100
they and they wouldn't come up as as you

370
00:16:20,750 --> 00:16:19,440
know officially non-existent uh so the

371
00:16:23,210 --> 00:16:20,760
only way that made sense is if they're

372
00:16:25,250 --> 00:16:23,220
government vehicles so at that point I

373
00:16:28,069 --> 00:16:25,260
thought okay there's more to this than

374
00:16:29,689 --> 00:16:28,079
just Damien suffering from meth-induced

375
00:16:31,850 --> 00:16:29,699
paranoia

376
00:16:33,470 --> 00:16:31,860
um so I asked them to try to like

377
00:16:36,410 --> 00:16:33,480
document everything as much as possible

378
00:16:39,110 --> 00:16:36,420
but you know and and other people have

379
00:16:40,550 --> 00:16:39,120
been through this uh the fact is it's

380
00:16:43,790 --> 00:16:40,560
very difficult to document everything

381
00:16:45,769 --> 00:16:43,800
you know as as your life is falling

382
00:16:47,810 --> 00:16:45,779
apart around you but he tried to do it

383
00:16:50,090 --> 00:16:47,820
as much as possible fortunately I was

384
00:16:53,150 --> 00:16:50,100
there to take a lot of notes

385
00:16:55,610 --> 00:16:53,160
uh so he starts telling me about

386
00:16:57,650 --> 00:16:55,620
um basically what sounds like electronic

387
00:16:59,090 --> 00:16:57,660
harassment

388
00:17:00,590 --> 00:16:59,100
um uh

389
00:17:03,470 --> 00:17:00,600
there's

390
00:17:05,270 --> 00:17:03,480
he describes he's been being bombarded

391
00:17:08,090 --> 00:17:05,280
by what I call hallucinations though

392
00:17:09,530 --> 00:17:08,100
that's not exactly what was going on but

393
00:17:12,949 --> 00:17:09,540
in other words he would look out the

394
00:17:15,049 --> 00:17:12,959
window and the the the scenery that had

395
00:17:16,850 --> 00:17:15,059
always been there the Vons in the

396
00:17:18,470 --> 00:17:16,860
parking lot wasn't there anymore now it

397
00:17:21,350 --> 00:17:18,480
looked like a Boris Vallejo painting

398
00:17:23,090 --> 00:17:21,360
with three moons in the sky uh and then

399
00:17:25,549 --> 00:17:23,100
but then he would open the door and it

400
00:17:27,110 --> 00:17:25,559
was the scene he that was always there

401
00:17:29,330 --> 00:17:27,120
there was the parking lot there was the

402
00:17:31,690 --> 00:17:29,340
bonds but through his window it was this

403
00:17:34,909 --> 00:17:31,700
weird surreal science fiction landscape

404
00:17:37,970 --> 00:17:34,919
uh or like one night he was laying in

405
00:17:41,090 --> 00:17:37,980
bed and they projected this silhouette

406
00:17:42,950 --> 00:17:41,100
of a of a hand holding a gun it would

407
00:17:44,270 --> 00:17:42,960
tilt down and point at his head and then

408
00:17:46,750 --> 00:17:44,280
tilt up again

409
00:17:50,330 --> 00:17:46,760
uh he saw this

410
00:17:53,630 --> 00:17:50,340
amorphous blob of black energy crawl

411
00:17:55,430 --> 00:17:53,640
across his bedroom floor at night and it

412
00:17:57,710 --> 00:17:55,440
crawled into his leather jacket which

413
00:17:59,630 --> 00:17:57,720
was lying on the floor another leather

414
00:18:02,390 --> 00:17:59,640
jacket kind of like filled up and then

415
00:18:04,190 --> 00:18:02,400
it crawled across the floor I was on a

416
00:18:07,010 --> 00:18:04,200
TV show called transcending reality

417
00:18:08,990 --> 00:18:07,020
which you can you can find the raw video

418
00:18:11,150 --> 00:18:09,000
footage of it on YouTube if you just go

419
00:18:14,630 --> 00:18:11,160
to YouTube punch in transcending reality

420
00:18:16,669 --> 00:18:14,640
and my name I think it'll come up uh it

421
00:18:21,409 --> 00:18:16,679
was host the show was hosted by four

422
00:18:25,010 --> 00:18:21,419
alien abductees including Melinda Leslie

423
00:18:27,529 --> 00:18:25,020
um and um and and various other people

424
00:18:29,810 --> 00:18:27,539
and when I got to that point I told them

425
00:18:31,370 --> 00:18:29,820
but the the amorphous blob of black

426
00:18:32,630 --> 00:18:31,380
energy is all of them turned to each

427
00:18:35,210 --> 00:18:32,640
other they said we've seen that same

428
00:18:36,590 --> 00:18:35,220
thing in in connection with alien

429
00:18:40,130 --> 00:18:36,600
abduction phenomenon which is

430
00:18:41,150 --> 00:18:40,140
interesting anyway uh I I had no idea

431
00:18:46,490 --> 00:18:41,160
that

432
00:18:50,870 --> 00:18:46,500
abductions until they were interviewing

433
00:18:54,409 --> 00:18:50,880
me uh and then uh more craziness is

434
00:18:55,789 --> 00:18:54,419
going on uh more harassment

435
00:18:57,350 --> 00:18:55,799
there would be all these people park

436
00:18:59,930 --> 00:18:57,360
outside his house honking their horns

437
00:19:03,350 --> 00:18:59,940
shining their lights then suddenly

438
00:19:05,870 --> 00:19:03,360
one day they all just pull away

439
00:19:08,930 --> 00:19:05,880
and take off and then one car comes in

440
00:19:10,970 --> 00:19:08,940
and it's Lita Johnson the NCIS agent she

441
00:19:13,010 --> 00:19:10,980
comes up knocks on the door Damien opens

442
00:19:14,870 --> 00:19:13,020
it and she says have you have you

443
00:19:17,630 --> 00:19:14,880
changed your mind have you reconsidered

444
00:19:19,130 --> 00:19:17,640
uh uh have you thought about perhaps

445
00:19:21,710 --> 00:19:19,140
cooperating now

446
00:19:25,970 --> 00:19:21,720
uh it's your memory better

447
00:19:27,909 --> 00:19:25,980
and Damian said no uh I can't cooperate

448
00:19:30,289 --> 00:19:27,919
with you because I don't know anything

449
00:19:32,510 --> 00:19:30,299
and she said oh well you know that's

450
00:19:34,909 --> 00:19:32,520
interesting here's my card with my phone

451
00:19:38,029 --> 00:19:34,919
number on it you call me if you change

452
00:19:39,710 --> 00:19:38,039
your mind or if any new information pops

453
00:19:41,630 --> 00:19:39,720
up in your memory

454
00:19:43,190 --> 00:19:41,640
and her and the two goons get back in

455
00:19:45,650 --> 00:19:43,200
her car and drive away the second she

456
00:19:47,210 --> 00:19:45,660
drives away all the cars the vehicles

457
00:19:48,710 --> 00:19:47,220
come back they start shining their

458
00:19:51,529 --> 00:19:48,720
lights again honking the horns

459
00:19:53,630 --> 00:19:51,539
everything continues

460
00:19:55,970 --> 00:19:53,640
um I should also mention that where

461
00:19:58,669 --> 00:19:55,980
Damian was living at the time in Pacific

462
00:20:01,490 --> 00:19:58,679
Beach he was surrounded by corporations

463
00:20:04,010 --> 00:20:01,500
like saic science applications

464
00:20:07,430 --> 00:20:04,020
international corporation which becomes

465
00:20:09,950 --> 00:20:07,440
important later on ATC American

466
00:20:11,750 --> 00:20:09,960
Technology Corporation and and these

467
00:20:13,789 --> 00:20:11,760
corporations they're they're they

468
00:20:17,210 --> 00:20:13,799
specialized in creating

469
00:20:19,370 --> 00:20:17,220
uh non-lethal technology they call it

470
00:20:21,890 --> 00:20:19,380
non-lethal it'll kill you but they call

471
00:20:23,450 --> 00:20:21,900
it non-lethal technology

472
00:20:26,690 --> 00:20:23,460
um

473
00:20:28,490 --> 00:20:26,700
including acoustic bullets

474
00:20:29,930 --> 00:20:28,500
electronic weapons

475
00:20:33,049 --> 00:20:29,940
Etc

476
00:20:35,150 --> 00:20:33,059
which is interesting because uh Damien

477
00:20:37,070 --> 00:20:35,160
experienced things like when one night

478
00:20:40,250 --> 00:20:37,080
when I was on the phone with him I

479
00:20:43,610 --> 00:20:40,260
suddenly started hearing all these pops

480
00:20:45,590 --> 00:20:43,620
and crashes and uh Damien who as I say

481
00:20:47,930 --> 00:20:45,600
has been living on the street in and out

482
00:20:51,650 --> 00:20:47,940
of jail he can handle a lot of stress he

483
00:20:54,110 --> 00:20:51,660
was reduced to a ball a quivering ball

484
00:20:56,690 --> 00:20:54,120
like like a little crying like a little

485
00:20:59,090 --> 00:20:56,700
girl curled up under the table while all

486
00:21:01,070 --> 00:20:59,100
the tchotchkes up on the shelves were

487
00:21:03,409 --> 00:21:01,080
shattering

488
00:21:05,029 --> 00:21:03,419
um seemingly for no reason

489
00:21:08,390 --> 00:21:05,039
and uh

490
00:21:10,310 --> 00:21:08,400
uh later I realized I thought it was

491
00:21:11,990 --> 00:21:10,320
interesting the ATC this corporation

492
00:21:13,190 --> 00:21:12,000
which was located within walking

493
00:21:15,049 --> 00:21:13,200
distance of damage Department

494
00:21:16,669 --> 00:21:15,059
specialized in creating acoustic bullets

495
00:21:19,909 --> 00:21:16,679
which is essentially invisible bullets

496
00:21:23,270 --> 00:21:21,830
um and Damian said several times and he

497
00:21:25,070 --> 00:21:23,280
didn't know any better you know if not

498
00:21:27,470 --> 00:21:25,080
for being taken out of the jail if not

499
00:21:29,450 --> 00:21:27,480
for interacting with Lita Johnson the

500
00:21:31,310 --> 00:21:29,460
NCIS agent uh he would have thought that

501
00:21:33,190 --> 00:21:31,320
his house was haunted if he would have

502
00:21:35,990 --> 00:21:33,200
thought there was a polar guys

503
00:21:38,870 --> 00:21:36,000
you know plaguing him

504
00:21:41,210 --> 00:21:38,880
um uh so then things started happening

505
00:21:43,610 --> 00:21:41,220
like his apartment it starts growing or

506
00:21:45,590 --> 00:21:43,620
shrinking uh depending on the occasion

507
00:21:47,690 --> 00:21:45,600
and he wasn't the only one who saw this

508
00:21:49,190 --> 00:21:47,700
his friends saw this as well his friends

509
00:21:52,010 --> 00:21:49,200
would come over and say is your house

510
00:21:53,390 --> 00:21:52,020
shrinking uh or they would conversely

511
00:21:55,130 --> 00:21:53,400
they might come in and say is the

512
00:21:57,649 --> 00:21:55,140
apartment growing

513
00:21:59,630 --> 00:21:57,659
the room would appear to be larger than

514
00:22:01,430 --> 00:21:59,640
it normally would be or would appear to

515
00:22:03,770 --> 00:22:01,440
be smaller

516
00:22:07,070 --> 00:22:03,780
but it was subtle

517
00:22:09,710 --> 00:22:07,080
um and uh

518
00:22:11,690 --> 00:22:09,720
all the neighbors slowly moved out of

519
00:22:12,770 --> 00:22:11,700
the apartment building and were replaced

520
00:22:14,870 --> 00:22:12,780
with new people

521
00:22:16,250 --> 00:22:14,880
which is interesting because the very

522
00:22:18,529 --> 00:22:16,260
first person who ever interviewed me

523
00:22:20,450 --> 00:22:18,539
about Camellia was Tessa dick the Widow

524
00:22:22,330 --> 00:22:20,460
of Philip K dick the science fiction

525
00:22:26,990 --> 00:22:22,340
writer who wrote Blade Runner et cetera

526
00:22:28,070 --> 00:22:27,000
uh and he suffered uh through very

527
00:22:31,370 --> 00:22:28,080
strange

528
00:22:33,470 --> 00:22:31,380
um government harassment in the 1970s

529
00:22:37,130 --> 00:22:33,480
which leads to him writing the book of

530
00:22:40,010 --> 00:22:37,140
Scanner Darkly and uh Tessa dick told me

531
00:22:41,990 --> 00:22:40,020
that when she read Camelio it sounded so

532
00:22:44,690 --> 00:22:42,000
much like the what she experienced the

533
00:22:46,310 --> 00:22:44,700
70s with Phil dick she said thank you

534
00:22:49,490 --> 00:22:46,320
for writing this book it explains a lot

535
00:22:50,630 --> 00:22:49,500
of stuff that Phil and I uh experienced

536
00:22:52,610 --> 00:22:50,640
and one of those things was everyone

537
00:22:53,930 --> 00:22:52,620
moving out of the apartment building she

538
00:22:56,330 --> 00:22:53,940
said that the apartment building or she

539
00:22:58,490 --> 00:22:56,340
and Phil lived ever everyone moved down

540
00:23:00,289 --> 00:22:58,500
knew people moved in and they would they

541
00:23:02,590 --> 00:23:00,299
would be seen bringing in weird

542
00:23:06,289 --> 00:23:02,600
equipment into the apartment next door

543
00:23:08,210 --> 00:23:06,299
and Phil would Phil and Tessa would hear

544
00:23:09,529 --> 00:23:08,220
voices talking to them through the radio

545
00:23:10,570 --> 00:23:09,539
even though it wasn't plugged into the

546
00:23:14,690 --> 00:23:10,580
wall

547
00:23:17,690 --> 00:23:14,700
uh harassing them uh just like Damien

548
00:23:19,970 --> 00:23:17,700
one day was in the kitchen and uh he's

549
00:23:21,649 --> 00:23:19,980
making lunch and these these two Jarhead

550
00:23:24,470 --> 00:23:21,659
looking guys are standing right outside

551
00:23:26,990 --> 00:23:24,480
his kitchen window talking about him

552
00:23:29,149 --> 00:23:27,000
saying like private details about his

553
00:23:31,789 --> 00:23:29,159
life as if he's not there

554
00:23:35,029 --> 00:23:31,799
uh and this was actually a common

555
00:23:37,010 --> 00:23:35,039
experience for him at this time so

556
00:23:39,110 --> 00:23:37,020
Damien is sitting there listening to all

557
00:23:41,810 --> 00:23:39,120
this he's gotten used to it to some

558
00:23:43,750 --> 00:23:41,820
extent uh he starts grabbing like flour

559
00:23:47,810 --> 00:23:43,760
peanut butter Jello

560
00:23:49,909 --> 00:23:47,820
uh well pasta sauce and he puts it in a

561
00:23:52,669 --> 00:23:49,919
bowl and stirs it up so it's a nice

562
00:23:55,970 --> 00:23:52,679
thick goo and then he just runs out the

563
00:23:57,710 --> 00:23:55,980
door throws it over the fence and all

564
00:24:00,710 --> 00:23:57,720
the goo like lands on their heads and

565
00:24:03,049 --> 00:24:00,720
they they run off uh into the Milan's

566
00:24:06,230 --> 00:24:03,059
parking lot trying to get the Slime uh

567
00:24:08,990 --> 00:24:06,240
out of their hair and uh I mentioned

568
00:24:10,610 --> 00:24:09,000
that because later on Damien calls me

569
00:24:12,890 --> 00:24:10,620
and says Hey look

570
00:24:16,310 --> 00:24:12,900
I think I'm going to call

571
00:24:18,950 --> 00:24:16,320
Lita Johnson and meet with her and I'll

572
00:24:21,409 --> 00:24:18,960
suggest that maybe I could help them get

573
00:24:23,390 --> 00:24:21,419
these goggles back

574
00:24:25,490 --> 00:24:23,400
um he'd heard rumors that maybe they had

575
00:24:28,250 --> 00:24:25,500
been sold to the Hell's Angels and that

576
00:24:31,490 --> 00:24:28,260
they were being used to smuggle drugs

577
00:24:34,789 --> 00:24:31,500
over the border between Mexico and

578
00:24:37,130 --> 00:24:34,799
um uh and and San Diego

579
00:24:38,510 --> 00:24:37,140
and I said you know if you do that

580
00:24:39,950 --> 00:24:38,520
they're gonna think you knew all this

581
00:24:41,810 --> 00:24:39,960
information all along and you've just

582
00:24:43,430 --> 00:24:41,820
been holding out like he said well maybe

583
00:24:45,890 --> 00:24:43,440
they'll give me a job like I can get on

584
00:24:47,810 --> 00:24:45,900
the payroll like I said that's not a

585
00:24:49,909 --> 00:24:47,820
good idea they're just going to think

586
00:24:52,430 --> 00:24:49,919
that this is like a Shakedown

587
00:24:54,950 --> 00:24:52,440
he and he said no no no I think I could

588
00:24:58,010 --> 00:24:54,960
make this work out to my advantage you

589
00:25:00,529 --> 00:24:58,020
know uh turn lemons in the lemonade

590
00:25:03,470 --> 00:25:00,539
right so he he calls

591
00:25:05,630 --> 00:25:03,480
Lita Johnson meets her at a bagel shop

592
00:25:07,970 --> 00:25:05,640
on Garnet Avenue if you're if you live

593
00:25:09,890 --> 00:25:07,980
in Pacific Beach in San Diego you'll

594
00:25:11,930 --> 00:25:09,900
know that there's only one bagel shop on

595
00:25:13,370 --> 00:25:11,940
Garnett Avenue so that's the one if

596
00:25:16,250 --> 00:25:13,380
you're there you want to go to see where

597
00:25:18,350 --> 00:25:16,260
it was it's still there he meets with

598
00:25:20,930 --> 00:25:18,360
Lita Johnson and her Superior this is

599
00:25:22,490 --> 00:25:20,940
how important this was to them Lela

600
00:25:25,430 --> 00:25:22,500
Johnson doesn't come along she brings

601
00:25:26,590 --> 00:25:25,440
her Superior with her they meet with

602
00:25:31,730 --> 00:25:26,600
Damien

603
00:25:33,710 --> 00:25:31,740
orange juice and a bagel

604
00:25:36,350 --> 00:25:33,720
uh and

605
00:25:39,110 --> 00:25:36,360
Damien says hey maybe I can help you out

606
00:25:41,450 --> 00:25:39,120
like maybe if you put me on the payroll

607
00:25:43,130 --> 00:25:41,460
I can try to help you retrieve these

608
00:25:44,930 --> 00:25:43,140
night vision goggles

609
00:25:47,690 --> 00:25:44,940
during during this whole conversation

610
00:25:49,850 --> 00:25:47,700
which lasted I don't know

611
00:25:51,529 --> 00:25:49,860
you know an hour or so

612
00:25:53,149 --> 00:25:51,539
Lita Johnson said a number of things

613
00:25:55,669 --> 00:25:53,159
that I thought were interesting like a

614
00:25:57,049 --> 00:25:55,679
keyhole into her Consciousness and into

615
00:25:58,190 --> 00:25:57,059
the consciousness of the people who

616
00:26:00,049 --> 00:25:58,200
employ her

617
00:26:02,090 --> 00:26:00,059
she was saying things like oh you know

618
00:26:03,529 --> 00:26:02,100
San Diego Pacific Beach this used to be

619
00:26:07,010 --> 00:26:03,539
such a great neighborhood such a great

620
00:26:09,830 --> 00:26:07,020
area military Town upright upstanding

621
00:26:11,930 --> 00:26:09,840
patriotic people lived here now it's a

622
00:26:14,029 --> 00:26:11,940
cesspool you know a bunch of drought

623
00:26:16,130 --> 00:26:14,039
drug addicts live in Pacific Beach a

624
00:26:17,570 --> 00:26:16,140
bunch of meth heads

625
00:26:20,269 --> 00:26:17,580
um you know we need to clean up this

626
00:26:22,310 --> 00:26:20,279
area and Damien has a certain kind of

627
00:26:24,169 --> 00:26:22,320
Candide like quality about them where

628
00:26:27,529 --> 00:26:24,179
you might be insulting him but he's not

629
00:26:29,390 --> 00:26:27,539
aware of it so he he's agreeing with her

630
00:26:31,370 --> 00:26:29,400
and he's saying oh yeah you know I hate

631
00:26:34,250 --> 00:26:31,380
those kinds of people we need to get

632
00:26:37,070 --> 00:26:34,260
them out of here she's not getting that

633
00:26:39,169 --> 00:26:37,080
she's insulting him she's talking about

634
00:26:42,950 --> 00:26:39,179
him and I could see

635
00:26:44,570 --> 00:26:42,960
her blood pressure probably Rising as as

636
00:26:46,490 --> 00:26:44,580
he's like she's insulting me he's not

637
00:26:49,310 --> 00:26:46,500
getting it

638
00:26:51,769 --> 00:26:49,320
then uh at one point Damien says to her

639
00:26:53,390 --> 00:26:51,779
listen I'll do anything I want I just

640
00:26:55,310 --> 00:26:53,400
want the soul to end I don't want to

641
00:26:59,630 --> 00:26:55,320
have any more food fights with the feds

642
00:27:01,730 --> 00:26:59,640
and at that moment Lita laughed and said

643
00:27:04,130 --> 00:27:01,740
oh yes that was amusing or something

644
00:27:07,070 --> 00:27:04,140
along those lines it was the only point

645
00:27:08,570 --> 00:27:07,080
where the the curtain was pulled back

646
00:27:10,010 --> 00:27:08,580
well actually there was there was one

647
00:27:12,110 --> 00:27:10,020
other incident later on which I'll get

648
00:27:13,610 --> 00:27:12,120
to it was it was one of one of the two

649
00:27:15,110 --> 00:27:13,620
moments where the curtain was pulled

650
00:27:16,850 --> 00:27:15,120
back and they actually admitted that

651
00:27:18,350 --> 00:27:16,860
something was going on the whole point

652
00:27:21,110 --> 00:27:18,360
of this is to make you think you're

653
00:27:24,590 --> 00:27:21,120
crazy so they never admit it it's it's

654
00:27:26,330 --> 00:27:24,600
it's classic gaslighting uh it's to make

655
00:27:28,010 --> 00:27:26,340
you think that what you know is

656
00:27:29,510 --> 00:27:28,020
happening is not actually happening and

657
00:27:32,570 --> 00:27:29,520
you might be crazy

658
00:27:34,549 --> 00:27:32,580
uh but at that when she and I can see

659
00:27:35,950 --> 00:27:34,559
it's so it's such a human thing to do

660
00:27:38,510 --> 00:27:35,960
like her

661
00:27:40,190 --> 00:27:38,520
reacting to it and saying oh yeah that

662
00:27:42,049 --> 00:27:40,200
was funny yeah we actually laughed at

663
00:27:45,110 --> 00:27:42,059
that yeah

664
00:27:46,789 --> 00:27:45,120
um and and so Damien at that point is

665
00:27:48,289 --> 00:27:46,799
when he proposes Hey listen put me on

666
00:27:49,730 --> 00:27:48,299
the payroll maybe I can help you you

667
00:27:51,289 --> 00:27:49,740
know maybe I can help you out I can be

668
00:27:54,590 --> 00:27:51,299
like a consultant

669
00:27:56,870 --> 00:27:54,600
or something and then her Superior just

670
00:27:58,549 --> 00:27:56,880
gets pissed off his face turns red and

671
00:28:00,049 --> 00:27:58,559
he starts like beating his fists on the

672
00:28:02,510 --> 00:28:00,059
table he's like you can't I don't

673
00:28:06,529 --> 00:28:02,520
negotiate with terrorists you know

674
00:28:08,390 --> 00:28:06,539
um uh and it's it went bad it like

675
00:28:10,909 --> 00:28:08,400
spiraled down from there and Damien

676
00:28:13,549 --> 00:28:10,919
insulted them oh yeah and he said the

677
00:28:15,950 --> 00:28:13,559
guy's like uh uh you know you're welcome

678
00:28:17,870 --> 00:28:15,960
for the bagel and the orange juice as if

679
00:28:20,510 --> 00:28:17,880
the bagel and the orange juice could

680
00:28:22,850 --> 00:28:20,520
make up for the month of electronic

681
00:28:24,710 --> 00:28:22,860
harassment and the electromagnetic

682
00:28:27,649 --> 00:28:24,720
poisoning

683
00:28:29,029 --> 00:28:27,659
and the uh uh

684
00:28:30,649 --> 00:28:29,039
institutional surveillance and

685
00:28:31,610 --> 00:28:30,659
harassment

686
00:28:33,710 --> 00:28:31,620
um

687
00:28:35,510 --> 00:28:33,720
so that that meeting didn't go well he

688
00:28:37,130 --> 00:28:35,520
called me and and told me and I said

689
00:28:39,409 --> 00:28:37,140
well I you know I could have predicted

690
00:28:41,690 --> 00:28:39,419
that but I I said to him you know what

691
00:28:43,070 --> 00:28:41,700
I wanted to get more confirmation about

692
00:28:44,690 --> 00:28:43,080
what was happening because I was not

693
00:28:48,169 --> 00:28:44,700
there physically you know I'm hearing

694
00:28:50,450 --> 00:28:48,179
all about this over the phone and I said

695
00:28:53,029 --> 00:28:50,460
um I could I go

696
00:28:55,909 --> 00:28:53,039
Damien give me delete his phone number

697
00:28:59,450 --> 00:28:55,919
uh and so he he gave me the phone number

698
00:29:00,470 --> 00:28:59,460
from the card and uh I decided to call

699
00:29:03,950 --> 00:29:00,480
her

700
00:29:06,649 --> 00:29:03,960
so I called the number and she answers

701
00:29:09,769 --> 00:29:06,659
uh identifies herself as special agent

702
00:29:14,090 --> 00:29:09,779
leader Johnson of the NCIS you know may

703
00:29:17,810 --> 00:29:14,100
I help you uh I say hey uh yeah my name

704
00:29:20,450 --> 00:29:17,820
is uh Robert Guffey I live in Torrance

705
00:29:23,389 --> 00:29:20,460
my friend Damian lives in Pacific Beach

706
00:29:25,909 --> 00:29:23,399
he claims that you're following him that

707
00:29:27,470 --> 00:29:25,919
you and your agency are following him

708
00:29:29,149 --> 00:29:27,480
is that true

709
00:29:31,909 --> 00:29:29,159
and she seemed like completely

710
00:29:33,830 --> 00:29:31,919
non-plussed a that anyone was calling

711
00:29:39,049 --> 00:29:33,840
her B that anyone was asking questions

712
00:29:41,149 --> 00:29:39,059
to her uh and the whole transcript of

713
00:29:43,610 --> 00:29:41,159
that conversation is in camellia

714
00:29:46,190 --> 00:29:43,620
everything she said was real just

715
00:29:49,190 --> 00:29:46,200
classic cover your ass kind of

716
00:29:51,529 --> 00:29:49,200
uh legalistic language

717
00:29:53,690 --> 00:29:51,539
uh the kind of language you use if

718
00:29:56,570 --> 00:29:53,700
you're not telling the truth or if

719
00:29:58,669 --> 00:29:56,580
you're trying to obfuscate the truth I I

720
00:30:02,210 --> 00:29:58,679
said is is he being followed and she

721
00:30:04,970 --> 00:30:02,220
immediately says uh no one in my agency

722
00:30:08,090 --> 00:30:04,980
is currently following your friend

723
00:30:09,409 --> 00:30:08,100
which is just a bizarre kind of broken

724
00:30:13,190 --> 00:30:09,419
back

725
00:30:15,169 --> 00:30:13,200
verbal calisthenics uh to be able to

726
00:30:16,789 --> 00:30:15,179
dream up the sentence like that off the

727
00:30:19,669 --> 00:30:16,799
top of your head you know it's probably

728
00:30:22,250 --> 00:30:19,679
true no one in her agency was following

729
00:30:26,090 --> 00:30:22,260
Damian yeah because she's farming it out

730
00:30:28,010 --> 00:30:26,100
either to another agency or to civilians

731
00:30:30,409 --> 00:30:28,020
um and uh

732
00:30:33,350 --> 00:30:30,419
the whole conversation went that way

733
00:30:34,789 --> 00:30:33,360
at one point I said Damian was so bad

734
00:30:37,610 --> 00:30:34,799
off at this point he was actually like

735
00:30:40,130 --> 00:30:37,620
urinating blood he had a constant

736
00:30:42,169 --> 00:30:40,140
metallic taste in his mouth he he had

737
00:30:44,090 --> 00:30:42,179
lost weight this is over the course of

738
00:30:47,810 --> 00:30:44,100
about six months now

739
00:30:49,130 --> 00:30:47,820
uh and uh I knew that the metallic taste

740
00:30:51,110 --> 00:30:49,140
in your mouth was a symptom of

741
00:30:53,570 --> 00:30:51,120
electromagnetic poisoning and I knew

742
00:30:54,710 --> 00:30:53,580
that because I was friends with Walter

743
00:30:56,690 --> 00:30:54,720
Beau art

744
00:30:57,830 --> 00:30:56,700
who wrote the book operation mind

745
00:31:00,529 --> 00:30:57,840
control

746
00:31:04,310 --> 00:31:00,539
published back in 1978

747
00:31:05,649 --> 00:31:04,320
which was the first major book about MK

748
00:31:08,810 --> 00:31:05,659
Ultra

749
00:31:10,130 --> 00:31:08,820
so I told Walter about all this as it

750
00:31:12,529 --> 00:31:10,140
was happening he said yeah that sounds

751
00:31:15,769 --> 00:31:12,539
like classic electromagnetic poisoning

752
00:31:19,190 --> 00:31:15,779
so I just wanted to get Damien out of

753
00:31:21,350 --> 00:31:19,200
out of Dodge so I I call I I said to her

754
00:31:23,870 --> 00:31:21,360
is it okay if he leaves town and she

755
00:31:26,990 --> 00:31:23,880
goes uh no we would prefer that he not

756
00:31:28,970 --> 00:31:27,000
leave town and I said so he's not under

757
00:31:31,130 --> 00:31:28,980
investigation but you don't want him to

758
00:31:33,830 --> 00:31:31,140
leave town she said that's right

759
00:31:35,450 --> 00:31:33,840
uh there's which is a complete Paradox

760
00:31:36,289 --> 00:31:35,460
you know they're not investigating him

761
00:31:37,850 --> 00:31:36,299
but

762
00:31:39,769 --> 00:31:37,860
they don't want them to leave town I

763
00:31:41,149 --> 00:31:39,779
said well why can't he leave town and

764
00:31:43,310 --> 00:31:41,159
she said it just might make things

765
00:31:45,470 --> 00:31:43,320
inconvenient later on

766
00:31:48,289 --> 00:31:45,480
again like none of this makes any sense

767
00:31:49,310 --> 00:31:48,299
either either he's under either they're

768
00:31:51,289 --> 00:31:49,320
investigating him or they're not

769
00:31:53,149 --> 00:31:51,299
investigating them she says they're not

770
00:31:55,430 --> 00:31:53,159
investigating them but she doesn't want

771
00:31:58,070 --> 00:31:55,440
them to leave town

772
00:31:59,450 --> 00:31:58,080
um so at the end of it the end of the

773
00:32:02,210 --> 00:31:59,460
conversation just ended with her like

774
00:32:04,370 --> 00:32:02,220
implying that Damian was crazy

775
00:32:04,970 --> 00:32:04,380
I hung up

776
00:32:07,789 --> 00:32:04,980
um

777
00:32:10,610 --> 00:32:07,799
around the same time

778
00:32:12,049 --> 00:32:10,620
Damien experiences this weird waking

779
00:32:15,289 --> 00:32:12,059
dream

780
00:32:16,850 --> 00:32:15,299
where uh I again I try to call him one

781
00:32:17,930 --> 00:32:16,860
day he's not there he's not there the

782
00:32:19,730 --> 00:32:17,940
second day he's not there the third day

783
00:32:21,649 --> 00:32:19,740
I think after three days I finally got a

784
00:32:23,690 --> 00:32:21,659
hold of him and I go where you know

785
00:32:25,190 --> 00:32:23,700
where have you been and he says what are

786
00:32:27,350 --> 00:32:25,200
you talking about

787
00:32:30,230 --> 00:32:27,360
I haven't been anywhere I've been home

788
00:32:32,210 --> 00:32:30,240
for the past three days and I go no

789
00:32:33,250 --> 00:32:32,220
uh I've been calling you you haven't

790
00:32:36,710 --> 00:32:33,260
been there

791
00:32:39,409 --> 00:32:36,720
and we realized that he had missing time

792
00:32:41,330 --> 00:32:39,419
literally like three days just gone

793
00:32:42,889 --> 00:32:41,340
and he said he had this weird raking

794
00:32:44,510 --> 00:32:42,899
dream they'd be sitting on his couch in

795
00:32:46,130 --> 00:32:44,520
the afternoon watching TV when suddenly

796
00:32:48,289 --> 00:32:46,140
he felt sleepy

797
00:32:50,810 --> 00:32:48,299
and then he had this vague image of

798
00:32:54,889 --> 00:32:50,820
people men coming into the house

799
00:32:57,529 --> 00:32:54,899
and he remembered putting his arms and

800
00:33:00,230 --> 00:32:57,539
over his chest like in like in an ex

801
00:33:02,570 --> 00:33:00,240
formation and they and they and they

802
00:33:05,269 --> 00:33:02,580
pulled these men pulled his arms back

803
00:33:08,570 --> 00:33:05,279
and then injected him with something now

804
00:33:10,990 --> 00:33:08,580
I I as I said Damien's uh drug of choice

805
00:33:14,450 --> 00:33:11,000
was heroin so he doesn't have any like

806
00:33:18,470 --> 00:33:14,460
uh he can slip a needle in his in his

807
00:33:22,190 --> 00:33:18,480
arm with no sense of anxiety or

808
00:33:23,870 --> 00:33:22,200
nervousness whatsoever uh but but in

809
00:33:26,750 --> 00:33:23,880
this case he is actually having this

810
00:33:29,810 --> 00:33:26,760
traumatic quote nightmare about men

811
00:33:32,210 --> 00:33:29,820
coming to his house and injecting him uh

812
00:33:35,630 --> 00:33:32,220
with a needle which is very strange and

813
00:33:38,330 --> 00:33:35,640
then he's got three missing days uh his

814
00:33:41,149 --> 00:33:38,340
wallet went missing from his apartment

815
00:33:43,610 --> 00:33:41,159
which is significant because he had met

816
00:33:45,710 --> 00:33:43,620
this guy at the beach this Beachcomber

817
00:33:47,389 --> 00:33:45,720
who had this black van he was selling

818
00:33:49,250 --> 00:33:47,399
for cheap I can't remember what it was

819
00:33:52,789 --> 00:33:49,260
now 500 bucks or whatever it's in the

820
00:33:55,610 --> 00:33:52,799
book and uh he was gonna go buy it so

821
00:33:57,830 --> 00:33:55,620
that he could get out of town uh but

822
00:34:00,590 --> 00:33:57,840
that's when the the waking dream

823
00:34:03,049 --> 00:34:00,600
happened and that's when the his wallet

824
00:34:04,070 --> 00:34:03,059
went missing so at that point I decided

825
00:34:05,750 --> 00:34:04,080
okay

826
00:34:07,909 --> 00:34:05,760
um and I should I should mention that

827
00:34:10,849 --> 00:34:07,919
also in the middle of all this is

828
00:34:13,010 --> 00:34:10,859
the invisible people which is a key

829
00:34:17,629 --> 00:34:13,020
detail that I should mention that he

830
00:34:19,490 --> 00:34:17,639
calls me at one point uh pretty like I I

831
00:34:21,409 --> 00:34:19,500
can't remember now and maybe it's in the

832
00:34:24,169 --> 00:34:21,419
book maybe two months into this maybe

833
00:34:25,849 --> 00:34:24,179
three months into all this he calls me

834
00:34:27,649 --> 00:34:25,859
and says that there were people in this

835
00:34:29,570 --> 00:34:27,659
house and he can't see them they're

836
00:34:31,849 --> 00:34:29,580
interacting with him they're pushing him

837
00:34:35,690 --> 00:34:31,859
uh he can kind of sense when they're

838
00:34:38,810 --> 00:34:35,700
there sometimes uh one time he sees them

839
00:34:41,270 --> 00:34:38,820
when he's in the bathroom and he was

840
00:34:43,849 --> 00:34:41,280
opening the the mirrored cabinet the

841
00:34:46,970 --> 00:34:43,859
medicine cabinet and as the the medicine

842
00:34:48,710 --> 00:34:46,980
cabinet door was opening as it was in

843
00:34:50,990 --> 00:34:48,720
motion he could see them

844
00:34:53,930 --> 00:34:51,000
in the mirror briefly and he described

845
00:34:55,490 --> 00:34:53,940
them as small people wearing some sort

846
00:34:58,730 --> 00:34:55,500
of like skin tight

847
00:35:00,829 --> 00:34:58,740
suit that like covered them head to toe

848
00:35:02,690 --> 00:35:00,839
but he caught he just caught and he said

849
00:35:05,450 --> 00:35:02,700
they were small like really

850
00:35:07,849 --> 00:35:05,460
tiny uh not not

851
00:35:10,250 --> 00:35:07,859
uh you know like he said like the size

852
00:35:12,230 --> 00:35:10,260
of a jockey something like that like

853
00:35:14,690 --> 00:35:12,240
small and slender

854
00:35:17,270 --> 00:35:14,700
um and um

855
00:35:19,069 --> 00:35:17,280
and I thought you know if they're using

856
00:35:20,750 --> 00:35:19,079
some sort of light bending technology it

857
00:35:22,190 --> 00:35:20,760
kind of makes sense that maybe you'd see

858
00:35:23,810 --> 00:35:22,200
him in the mirror while the mirror was

859
00:35:25,670 --> 00:35:23,820
in motion Damien's not an optical

860
00:35:28,430 --> 00:35:25,680
physicist it's not something he would

861
00:35:30,109 --> 00:35:28,440
you know it's not um

862
00:35:33,530 --> 00:35:30,119
it's not something you would think of

863
00:35:35,690 --> 00:35:33,540
but it seemed on point in a weird way

864
00:35:37,670 --> 00:35:35,700
then later he said sometimes he'd see

865
00:35:40,370 --> 00:35:37,680
them as these weird dots in the air

866
00:35:43,069 --> 00:35:40,380
like a little like a an outline and

867
00:35:46,069 --> 00:35:43,079
these little scintillating dots almost

868
00:35:48,530 --> 00:35:46,079
like what uh one sees if one suffers

869
00:35:50,329 --> 00:35:48,540
from intense migraines uh sometimes

870
00:35:51,470 --> 00:35:50,339
people like that will report seeing

871
00:35:53,450 --> 00:35:51,480
auras

872
00:35:56,210 --> 00:35:53,460
in the air he said that's kind of like

873
00:35:58,970 --> 00:35:56,220
what it looked like these little auras

874
00:36:01,790 --> 00:35:58,980
that only happened a couple of times uh

875
00:36:05,630 --> 00:36:01,800
and I thought that's that's fascinating

876
00:36:08,270 --> 00:36:05,640
um and disturbing uh he saw he was one

877
00:36:10,550 --> 00:36:08,280
of them fell out of the tree he saw them

878
00:36:12,530 --> 00:36:10,560
fall the tree and impact the ground uh

879
00:36:14,990 --> 00:36:12,540
tree outside his house he was at the

880
00:36:17,050 --> 00:36:15,000
beach one night and he saw tracks in the

881
00:36:19,670 --> 00:36:17,060
sand and there was no vehicle there

882
00:36:20,690 --> 00:36:19,680
following him

883
00:36:22,790 --> 00:36:20,700
um

884
00:36:24,770 --> 00:36:22,800
so all this stuff is going on finally I

885
00:36:28,250 --> 00:36:24,780
I say I go you've got to get out and

886
00:36:29,390 --> 00:36:28,260
this is like January of um 2004 at this

887
00:36:31,190 --> 00:36:29,400
point

888
00:36:34,970 --> 00:36:31,200
I go you just gotta leave town so I

889
00:36:38,089 --> 00:36:34,980
decide to I volunteered to Western Union

890
00:36:40,069 --> 00:36:38,099
him the money to go buy the van

891
00:36:41,930 --> 00:36:40,079
and I didn't tell him I was going to do

892
00:36:43,910 --> 00:36:41,940
it I just did it now if you've ever

893
00:36:45,470 --> 00:36:43,920
Western Union somebody you need a

894
00:36:48,770 --> 00:36:45,480
password

895
00:36:50,510 --> 00:36:48,780
so they can pick up the money so I came

896
00:36:54,290 --> 00:36:50,520
up with a

897
00:36:56,990 --> 00:36:54,300
a password and

898
00:36:58,310 --> 00:36:57,000
I called Damien and I go listen I just

899
00:37:00,829 --> 00:36:58,320
sent you the money

900
00:37:02,510 --> 00:37:00,839
uh go by the van

901
00:37:03,230 --> 00:37:02,520
put your stuff in it and just get out of

902
00:37:07,069 --> 00:37:03,240
town

903
00:37:09,050 --> 00:37:07,079
and he's he's very grateful thank God I

904
00:37:11,089 --> 00:37:09,060
go let me give you the password he goes

905
00:37:13,130 --> 00:37:11,099
no no don't give it to me now

906
00:37:14,510 --> 00:37:13,140
let me get all my stuff ready then give

907
00:37:16,490 --> 00:37:14,520
it to me he was afraid if I gave it to

908
00:37:18,170 --> 00:37:16,500
him with a phone anybody listening would

909
00:37:19,490 --> 00:37:18,180
hear it and go like intercept the money

910
00:37:20,750 --> 00:37:19,500
or they'd pick it up and then he

911
00:37:23,930 --> 00:37:20,760
wouldn't be able to get it

912
00:37:25,550 --> 00:37:23,940
so I said okay so he he gathers all this

913
00:37:28,250 --> 00:37:25,560
stuff together

914
00:37:29,810 --> 00:37:28,260
calls me like an hour two hours later he

915
00:37:31,670 --> 00:37:29,820
goes okay give me the password I'm about

916
00:37:35,870 --> 00:37:31,680
to give him the password I go the

917
00:37:37,250 --> 00:37:35,880
password is and then the phone goes dead

918
00:37:38,210 --> 00:37:37,260
it's like okay that could be a

919
00:37:40,190 --> 00:37:38,220
coincidence

920
00:37:42,770 --> 00:37:40,200
call him a second time I go here's the

921
00:37:45,470 --> 00:37:42,780
password the phone goes dead I tried a

922
00:37:47,390 --> 00:37:45,480
third time again phone goes dead that

923
00:37:48,349 --> 00:37:47,400
happened like like a dozen times in a

924
00:37:51,829 --> 00:37:48,359
row

925
00:37:53,810 --> 00:37:51,839
and finally I I realized uh I thought of

926
00:37:56,030 --> 00:37:53,820
something that when you place a collect

927
00:37:58,190 --> 00:37:56,040
call to someone there's a brief moment

928
00:37:59,650 --> 00:37:58,200
when the operator is saying uh will you

929
00:38:02,450 --> 00:37:59,660
accept the charges

930
00:38:05,690 --> 00:38:02,460
uh and you can hear each other for a

931
00:38:07,910 --> 00:38:05,700
brief moment so so I call the operator I

932
00:38:10,430 --> 00:38:07,920
said I want to place a collect call to

933
00:38:13,849 --> 00:38:10,440
my friend in Pacific Beach

934
00:38:18,650 --> 00:38:13,859
she gets Damien on the line and she says

935
00:38:21,290 --> 00:38:18,660
will you accept a collect call and as

936
00:38:23,690 --> 00:38:21,300
at that moment I yell out a hint

937
00:38:26,690 --> 00:38:23,700
uh as to what the password is

938
00:38:29,510 --> 00:38:26,700
uh which was pornographic in nature and

939
00:38:31,250 --> 00:38:29,520
and he uh he me I heard him laugh and

940
00:38:33,410 --> 00:38:31,260
then the line went dead like I knew when

941
00:38:36,050 --> 00:38:33,420
I heard him laugh I knew he knew what

942
00:38:39,530 --> 00:38:36,060
the code word was so he went he was able

943
00:38:42,290 --> 00:38:39,540
to pick up the money he buys the van

944
00:38:44,450 --> 00:38:42,300
throws all his stuff in it and he leaves

945
00:38:46,370 --> 00:38:44,460
he leaves a note on the door oh but he

946
00:38:48,710 --> 00:38:46,380
he tells his landlord I'm going to take

947
00:38:50,870 --> 00:38:48,720
off the landlord couldn't have been more

948
00:38:52,430 --> 00:38:50,880
relieved Damien said that over the

949
00:38:54,290 --> 00:38:52,440
course of these months it was like the

950
00:38:57,589 --> 00:38:54,300
the landlord was under more stress than

951
00:38:59,569 --> 00:38:57,599
Damien uh Damien was losing weight the

952
00:39:02,210 --> 00:38:59,579
landlord was losing weight

953
00:39:05,630 --> 00:39:02,220
and and when Damien says I'm leaving the

954
00:39:07,069 --> 00:39:05,640
landlord was like oh my God thank you

955
00:39:09,290 --> 00:39:07,079
um

956
00:39:12,230 --> 00:39:09,300
note on the door it says I've gone west

957
00:39:14,750 --> 00:39:12,240
which would be into the ocean and he

958
00:39:16,730 --> 00:39:14,760
throws all the stuff into the ban and he

959
00:39:19,730 --> 00:39:16,740
takes off

960
00:39:21,170 --> 00:39:19,740
he calls me a few hours later to tell me

961
00:39:23,329 --> 00:39:21,180
that there are these little flying

962
00:39:25,970 --> 00:39:23,339
saucers following him around

963
00:39:30,010 --> 00:39:25,980
following the van now keep in mind this

964
00:39:32,870 --> 00:39:30,020
is early 2004 drones are not an everyday

965
00:39:35,270 --> 00:39:32,880
common occurrence it's drones are

966
00:39:37,849 --> 00:39:35,280
science fiction in 2004.

967
00:39:39,410 --> 00:39:37,859
uh but what he described were

968
00:39:41,690 --> 00:39:39,420
essentially drones he said they look

969
00:39:42,730 --> 00:39:41,700
like little like George adovsky flying

970
00:39:44,930 --> 00:39:42,740
saucers

971
00:39:46,910 --> 00:39:44,940
uh circular

972
00:39:49,250 --> 00:39:46,920
following him around

973
00:39:51,370 --> 00:39:49,260
following his van

974
00:39:54,050 --> 00:39:51,380
um and he he

975
00:39:58,630 --> 00:39:54,060
drives from um

976
00:40:01,970 --> 00:39:58,640
Pacific Beach uh goes all the way to

977
00:40:05,750 --> 00:40:01,980
Minnesota where his

978
00:40:07,490 --> 00:40:05,760
girlfriend lived with his young son who

979
00:40:10,210 --> 00:40:07,500
he hadn't seen in a long time

980
00:40:13,490 --> 00:40:10,220
so he goes there he stops off a bathroom

981
00:40:15,470 --> 00:40:13,500
uh in Minnesota

982
00:40:18,530 --> 00:40:15,480
this was the this was the second time

983
00:40:21,349 --> 00:40:18,540
where the the the the emerald curtain

984
00:40:23,810 --> 00:40:21,359
was pushed aside for a moment he goes

985
00:40:26,810 --> 00:40:23,820
into this bathroom in Minnesota he's

986
00:40:29,870 --> 00:40:26,820
washing his hands in the sink and this

987
00:40:32,630 --> 00:40:29,880
guy comes in to the bathroom Cycles on

988
00:40:35,450 --> 00:40:32,640
up to him the sink right next to him

989
00:40:39,410 --> 00:40:35,460
and says to him uh if you just give them

990
00:40:41,870 --> 00:40:39,420
all back all this will end and Damien

991
00:40:43,910 --> 00:40:41,880
gets like a chill up his spine and then

992
00:40:47,450 --> 00:40:43,920
a third guy comes in at that point and

993
00:40:48,770 --> 00:40:47,460
grabs this this this other guy who just

994
00:40:51,650 --> 00:40:48,780
spoken to Damien grabbed him by the

995
00:40:53,150 --> 00:40:51,660
collar and like drags him out as if as

996
00:40:54,410 --> 00:40:53,160
if he had done something wrong like he'd

997
00:40:57,109 --> 00:40:54,420
broken protocol

998
00:40:59,390 --> 00:40:57,119
uh and and the guy when he said it it

999
00:41:01,790 --> 00:40:59,400
wasn't like a threatening tone like if

1000
00:41:03,650 --> 00:41:01,800
you give this all back it'll all and it

1001
00:41:05,870 --> 00:41:03,660
was more like a pleading tone like can

1002
00:41:08,150 --> 00:41:05,880
you please give this all back so this

1003
00:41:11,270 --> 00:41:08,160
will answer me so it's like I don't have

1004
00:41:13,609 --> 00:41:11,280
to follow you around anymore uh and

1005
00:41:15,770 --> 00:41:13,619
Damian was like oh my God that that was

1006
00:41:17,750 --> 00:41:15,780
bizarre because again it was you know

1007
00:41:19,430 --> 00:41:17,760
you're the the point of it is to make

1008
00:41:21,170 --> 00:41:19,440
the person think he's going crazy so if

1009
00:41:22,910 --> 00:41:21,180
someone comes in and says Hey listen

1010
00:41:25,250 --> 00:41:22,920
just give this stuff back well that's

1011
00:41:26,930 --> 00:41:25,260
you know that's confirming that you're

1012
00:41:28,430 --> 00:41:26,940
not crazy you're actually being followed

1013
00:41:31,490 --> 00:41:28,440
around

1014
00:41:33,349 --> 00:41:31,500
um at one point his van breaks down not

1015
00:41:35,690 --> 00:41:33,359
long after that and I get a phone call

1016
00:41:38,030 --> 00:41:35,700
at 10 o'clock at night from these two

1017
00:41:38,890 --> 00:41:38,040
good old boys and I can't remember their

1018
00:41:43,849 --> 00:41:38,900
names

1019
00:41:45,410 --> 00:41:43,859
they had like these thick Southern

1020
00:41:47,690 --> 00:41:45,420
Accents

1021
00:41:50,050 --> 00:41:47,700
the guy calls me the phone rings I pick

1022
00:41:53,510 --> 00:41:50,060
it up I hear this voice go

1023
00:41:55,069 --> 00:41:53,520
uh you Professor Duffy and I go yeah he

1024
00:41:57,470 --> 00:41:55,079
goes you know Damien

1025
00:42:00,470 --> 00:41:57,480
and then I immediately think what what

1026
00:42:02,810 --> 00:42:00,480
now what's going to happen now uh and

1027
00:42:05,150 --> 00:42:02,820
the guy go yeah I know Damien he goes

1028
00:42:06,650 --> 00:42:05,160
well your friend uh his uh his van broke

1029
00:42:09,829 --> 00:42:06,660
down the side of the road we picked him

1030
00:42:11,329 --> 00:42:09,839
up and uh we took him back to our house

1031
00:42:13,730 --> 00:42:11,339
he's been telling us all these crazy

1032
00:42:15,290 --> 00:42:13,740
stories about invisible midgets and uh

1033
00:42:18,470 --> 00:42:15,300
little flying saucers following around

1034
00:42:20,810 --> 00:42:18,480
and it's crazy you see any of this stuff

1035
00:42:24,530 --> 00:42:20,820
true he says you you know about all this

1036
00:42:27,470 --> 00:42:24,540
and I go uh yes indeed everything he's

1037
00:42:29,690 --> 00:42:27,480
told you is true uh and I I gave him

1038
00:42:31,550 --> 00:42:29,700
like a I gave this guy like a short

1039
00:42:34,970 --> 00:42:31,560
synopsis of everything that had occurred

1040
00:42:36,710 --> 00:42:34,980
at that point and these these guys

1041
00:42:38,810 --> 00:42:36,720
Damien one of these guys to like help

1042
00:42:41,210 --> 00:42:38,820
him fix a van so he keeps going on but

1043
00:42:43,250 --> 00:42:41,220
for some reason they like they thought

1044
00:42:45,829 --> 00:42:43,260
he was uh

1045
00:42:48,170 --> 00:42:45,839
somehow inhabited by demons or something

1046
00:42:50,990 --> 00:42:48,180
and he was lying to them

1047
00:42:53,930 --> 00:42:51,000
so I convinced him that he was no you

1048
00:42:56,510 --> 00:42:53,940
don't need to exercise him uh or

1049
00:42:59,329 --> 00:42:56,520
anything he's not inhabited by demons

1050
00:43:01,569 --> 00:42:59,339
he's not possessed uh all these things

1051
00:43:05,329 --> 00:43:01,579
actually he was seeing invisible people

1052
00:43:07,130 --> 00:43:05,339
all that happened acoustic bullets you

1053
00:43:09,410 --> 00:43:07,140
know electromagnetic radiation poisoning

1054
00:43:11,390 --> 00:43:09,420
yes you know I spoke to the to the woman

1055
00:43:13,490 --> 00:43:11,400
who's following him around yes this is

1056
00:43:15,530 --> 00:43:13,500
all happening so I was able to convince

1057
00:43:18,109 --> 00:43:15,540
them and now as I'm talking to him on

1058
00:43:19,490 --> 00:43:18,119
the phone the other guy yells out hey

1059
00:43:21,710 --> 00:43:19,500
Zeke or whatever the hell his name was

1060
00:43:23,870 --> 00:43:21,720
come over here and they go to the window

1061
00:43:26,390 --> 00:43:23,880
as I'm talking to the guy on the phone

1062
00:43:28,069 --> 00:43:26,400
the guy tells me that he opens the

1063
00:43:30,790 --> 00:43:28,079
curtain and sees that there's a little

1064
00:43:32,470 --> 00:43:30,800
tiny circular

1065
00:43:34,849 --> 00:43:32,480
vehicle

1066
00:43:36,050 --> 00:43:34,859
flying outside the house there's a

1067
00:43:37,730 --> 00:43:36,060
little drone

1068
00:43:39,349 --> 00:43:37,740
hovering outside the house that has

1069
00:43:40,910 --> 00:43:39,359
followed them from the side of the road

1070
00:43:43,010 --> 00:43:40,920
to their house

1071
00:43:44,390 --> 00:43:43,020
uh and now they're like totally freaking

1072
00:43:46,670 --> 00:43:44,400
out and of course now they believe

1073
00:43:49,550 --> 00:43:46,680
everything Damien said and I I convinced

1074
00:43:52,609 --> 00:43:49,560
them to help him fix the van get gas in

1075
00:43:54,710 --> 00:43:52,619
it and send them on his way uh which

1076
00:43:57,530 --> 00:43:54,720
which he did and he ends up in a little

1077
00:43:59,750 --> 00:43:57,540
town called Winona Kansas

1078
00:44:02,109 --> 00:43:59,760
which is which has a population of like

1079
00:44:05,569 --> 00:44:02,119
200 people you can look it up

1080
00:44:08,630 --> 00:44:05,579
uh and for some reason when you get to

1081
00:44:11,630 --> 00:44:08,640
that town the everyone following him

1082
00:44:13,609 --> 00:44:11,640
just backs off and I don't know if it's

1083
00:44:16,069 --> 00:44:13,619
because there's only 200 people there

1084
00:44:18,109 --> 00:44:16,079
and so it would you know if a parade of

1085
00:44:20,270 --> 00:44:18,119
Jar heads are following this black van

1086
00:44:22,730 --> 00:44:20,280
around in a town of 200 people I think

1087
00:44:25,010 --> 00:44:22,740
that would kind of stand out uh in a way

1088
00:44:27,770 --> 00:44:25,020
that it would not stand out in LA or San

1089
00:44:29,930 --> 00:44:27,780
Diego or in a big city

1090
00:44:32,450 --> 00:44:29,940
or it could be that everyone in Winona

1091
00:44:34,250 --> 00:44:32,460
Kansas has guns and so these

1092
00:44:36,109 --> 00:44:34,260
invisibility suits they don't make you

1093
00:44:37,730 --> 00:44:36,119
um Bulletproof

1094
00:44:40,550 --> 00:44:37,740
so maybe that's another reason they

1095
00:44:42,530 --> 00:44:40,560
pulled back or it could be it's just

1096
00:44:44,950 --> 00:44:42,540
part of the pattern I've talked to other

1097
00:44:46,670 --> 00:44:44,960
people who've suffered from this kind of

1098
00:44:48,290 --> 00:44:46,680
unconstitutional surveillance and

1099
00:44:50,450 --> 00:44:48,300
harassment and very often they will pull

1100
00:44:52,010 --> 00:44:50,460
back uh just so that they can come back

1101
00:44:53,870 --> 00:44:52,020
later on pull the rug out from under you

1102
00:44:56,270 --> 00:44:53,880
you know you can think oh God it's over

1103
00:44:58,190 --> 00:44:56,280
I can relax and then suddenly boom it

1104
00:45:01,250 --> 00:44:58,200
starts up all over again maybe that's

1105
00:45:04,010 --> 00:45:01,260
what it was I don't know so he he's able

1106
00:45:06,829 --> 00:45:04,020
to like sit down he gets a

1107
00:45:10,609 --> 00:45:06,839
an apartment a house of the house

1108
00:45:15,410 --> 00:45:10,619
actually in Winona uh and he gets a job

1109
00:45:17,270 --> 00:45:15,420
and he uh is um is able to

1110
00:45:18,950 --> 00:45:17,280
get on the internet

1111
00:45:21,410 --> 00:45:18,960
and he's trying to find anything that

1112
00:45:23,569 --> 00:45:21,420
looks like the invisibility stuff that

1113
00:45:27,109 --> 00:45:23,579
he witnessed he finds articles about

1114
00:45:30,050 --> 00:45:27,119
Professor Toshi in Japan who is this guy

1115
00:45:31,730 --> 00:45:30,060
who uh is famous for having created

1116
00:45:35,089 --> 00:45:31,740
this what he calls like a Harry Potter

1117
00:45:40,190 --> 00:45:37,730
and uh but it's not like anything that

1118
00:45:42,050 --> 00:45:40,200
Damien saw in Pacific Beach it just

1119
00:45:45,170 --> 00:45:42,060
makes you invisible from like one angle

1120
00:45:47,030 --> 00:45:45,180
what he saw was 360 Degrees like way

1121
00:45:50,569 --> 00:45:47,040
more sophisticated than that

1122
00:45:53,270 --> 00:45:50,579
uh and so he stumbles across this um

1123
00:45:54,770 --> 00:45:53,280
article for the military review where

1124
00:45:56,990 --> 00:45:54,780
they're talking about this inventor

1125
00:45:59,829 --> 00:45:57,000
named Richard schulenger

1126
00:46:02,870 --> 00:45:59,839
leads him to a website called

1127
00:46:06,530 --> 00:46:02,880
camelio.net and it was this website by

1128
00:46:08,750 --> 00:46:06,540
the by this guy Richard Neal schollenger

1129
00:46:10,190 --> 00:46:08,760
Damien said reading the description of

1130
00:46:13,370 --> 00:46:10,200
it and he says this sounds more like

1131
00:46:14,569 --> 00:46:13,380
what I saw uh and he goes you should

1132
00:46:16,430 --> 00:46:14,579
check it out

1133
00:46:17,870 --> 00:46:16,440
and I go okay I'll look at it but I

1134
00:46:19,490 --> 00:46:17,880
didn't think he would have I didn't

1135
00:46:22,130 --> 00:46:19,500
think it would bear any fruit

1136
00:46:25,069 --> 00:46:22,140
but I looked at it and I was surprised

1137
00:46:27,290 --> 00:46:25,079
when I'm reading about the inventor

1138
00:46:28,490 --> 00:46:27,300
section and it said that Richard

1139
00:46:33,290 --> 00:46:28,500
Schoenberg

1140
00:46:34,490 --> 00:46:33,300
was a 33rd degree Scottish Rite Mason a

1141
00:46:37,670 --> 00:46:34,500
member of the

1142
00:46:40,670 --> 00:46:37,680
Scottish riot in Long Beach well I'm a

1143
00:46:43,370 --> 00:46:40,680
32nd degree Scottish Rite Mason in Long

1144
00:46:44,329 --> 00:46:43,380
Beach so we're a member of the same

1145
00:46:46,309 --> 00:46:44,339
Lodge

1146
00:46:48,170 --> 00:46:46,319
so I think I must have met this guy at

1147
00:46:53,089 --> 00:46:48,180
some point so I don't have any memory of

1148
00:46:56,450 --> 00:46:53,099
that and so I email him I say hey I'm in

1149
00:46:59,089 --> 00:46:56,460
your Lodge I'm a writer I've interviewed

1150
00:47:00,890 --> 00:46:59,099
people like Bishop Stephen Heller the

1151
00:47:02,450 --> 00:47:00,900
bishop of the Gnostic Church in Los

1152
00:47:04,970 --> 00:47:02,460
Angeles I've interviewed all these other

1153
00:47:07,010 --> 00:47:04,980
Paul Lafley the painter and all these

1154
00:47:08,690 --> 00:47:07,020
other people uh I've written for

1155
00:47:10,190 --> 00:47:08,700
paranoia and I've written for New Dawn

1156
00:47:13,670 --> 00:47:10,200
magazine and

1157
00:47:16,010 --> 00:47:13,680
et cetera et cetera 14 times I'd like to

1158
00:47:17,809 --> 00:47:16,020
interview you about your technology he

1159
00:47:19,370 --> 00:47:17,819
writes back almost immediately and he

1160
00:47:22,069 --> 00:47:19,380
says um

1161
00:47:24,290 --> 00:47:22,079
I'd love to talk to you

1162
00:47:27,589 --> 00:47:24,300
um he's Stephen Heller is a friend of

1163
00:47:29,750 --> 00:47:27,599
mine uh that's crazy you interviewed him

1164
00:47:32,270 --> 00:47:29,760
um why don't we meet at the lodge this

1165
00:47:34,370 --> 00:47:32,280
Saturday and uh because the rituals were

1166
00:47:37,370 --> 00:47:34,380
usually performed on a Saturday morning

1167
00:47:38,690 --> 00:47:37,380
uh and so he's like after the rituals we

1168
00:47:40,670 --> 00:47:38,700
can go have lunch

1169
00:47:44,150 --> 00:47:40,680
and you can interview me

1170
00:47:46,010 --> 00:47:44,160
fantastic okay so I I contact Damien I

1171
00:47:49,849 --> 00:47:46,020
go yeah he

1172
00:47:51,890 --> 00:47:49,859
he lives here in in Costa Mesa and uh I

1173
00:47:54,710 --> 00:47:51,900
can interview him this Saturday Damien

1174
00:47:55,970 --> 00:47:54,720
immediately says I'll be there so he he

1175
00:47:57,710 --> 00:47:55,980
was having some dispute with his

1176
00:48:00,069 --> 00:47:57,720
landlord so he bought a bunch of wet

1177
00:48:03,349 --> 00:48:00,079
cement and just poured it into the uh

1178
00:48:07,069 --> 00:48:03,359
into the kitchen sink added to the uh

1179
00:48:08,569 --> 00:48:07,079
into the bathtub and then uh left an Fu

1180
00:48:10,430 --> 00:48:08,579
note for him and throws everything he

1181
00:48:13,910 --> 00:48:10,440
owns into the black man and then drives

1182
00:48:15,349 --> 00:48:13,920
away from Winona Kansas uh to to Long

1183
00:48:18,770 --> 00:48:15,359
Beach

1184
00:48:22,370 --> 00:48:18,780
and uh he's able to um

1185
00:48:24,230 --> 00:48:22,380
uh he meets me outside the lodge

1186
00:48:25,849 --> 00:48:24,240
uh I don't know it was around noon or

1187
00:48:27,109 --> 00:48:25,859
something like that and I introduced him

1188
00:48:28,970 --> 00:48:27,119
to

1189
00:48:34,309 --> 00:48:28,980
Richard

1190
00:48:38,210 --> 00:48:34,319
car and his license plate says camellio

1191
00:48:40,309 --> 00:48:38,220
on it uh and uh I say this is my friend

1192
00:48:41,050 --> 00:48:40,319
Damien he's going to join us for the

1193
00:48:44,630 --> 00:48:41,060
interview

1194
00:48:47,030 --> 00:48:44,640
uh Richard says that's fine so we we

1195
00:48:49,490 --> 00:48:47,040
took him out to George's Greek Cafe on

1196
00:48:52,069 --> 00:48:49,500
Pine Avenue in Long Beach we had lunch

1197
00:48:55,849 --> 00:48:52,079
and then we take him to my office on

1198
00:48:57,410 --> 00:48:55,859
campus at CSU Long Beach and

1199
00:49:00,829 --> 00:48:57,420
um interviewed him

1200
00:49:03,050 --> 00:49:00,839
for for like two hours and a half maybe

1201
00:49:05,270 --> 00:49:03,060
longer uh

1202
00:49:07,370 --> 00:49:05,280
I didn't think that this interview was

1203
00:49:09,230 --> 00:49:07,380
actually going to tie in in any way with

1204
00:49:11,030 --> 00:49:09,240
Damien's experiences I I thought it

1205
00:49:13,370 --> 00:49:11,040
would be fascinating but I really didn't

1206
00:49:15,650 --> 00:49:13,380
think it was going to tie in

1207
00:49:17,930 --> 00:49:15,660
uh

1208
00:49:20,329 --> 00:49:17,940
they start asking questions and and and

1209
00:49:22,670 --> 00:49:20,339
we haven't told him anything yet about

1210
00:49:25,490 --> 00:49:22,680
Richard's experiences and he just

1211
00:49:27,050 --> 00:49:25,500
everything he says aligns perfectly with

1212
00:49:27,829 --> 00:49:27,060
everything that Damian has already told

1213
00:49:30,470 --> 00:49:27,839
me

1214
00:49:33,349 --> 00:49:30,480
uh Richard starts talking about how he's

1215
00:49:35,089 --> 00:49:33,359
hired a lawyer he's initiated a lawsuit

1216
00:49:37,670 --> 00:49:35,099
against the military he thinks the

1217
00:49:38,770 --> 00:49:37,680
military stole his optical camouflage

1218
00:49:43,250 --> 00:49:38,780
technology

1219
00:49:45,050 --> 00:49:43,260
uh he says that he met with the Navy

1220
00:49:46,849 --> 00:49:45,060
10 years prior

1221
00:49:49,069 --> 00:49:46,859
they seemed interested

1222
00:49:51,109 --> 00:49:49,079
he took him out to the lab that he

1223
00:49:52,970 --> 00:49:51,119
shared with Dr Lev Berger in Hemet

1224
00:49:54,109 --> 00:49:52,980
California which is in the middle of

1225
00:49:57,490 --> 00:49:54,119
nowhere

1226
00:49:59,450 --> 00:49:57,500
uh I've been to that lab

1227
00:50:03,290 --> 00:49:59,460
they showed

1228
00:50:06,109 --> 00:50:03,300
intended to do they seemed interested

1229
00:50:08,390 --> 00:50:06,119
and then just ghosted them

1230
00:50:11,930 --> 00:50:08,400
same thing with he said we also met with

1231
00:50:13,970 --> 00:50:11,940
a corporation called faic in based in

1232
00:50:17,089 --> 00:50:13,980
San Diego the science applications

1233
00:50:20,390 --> 00:50:17,099
international corporation uh and they

1234
00:50:23,510 --> 00:50:20,400
also seemed interested and then

1235
00:50:28,250 --> 00:50:23,520
act away at the last minute

1236
00:50:29,870 --> 00:50:28,260
again this was many years prior to to

1237
00:50:31,550 --> 00:50:29,880
to this interview

1238
00:50:33,970 --> 00:50:31,560
uh

1239
00:50:37,430 --> 00:50:33,980
this interview would have taken place in

1240
00:50:39,410 --> 00:50:37,440
2006 early 2006.

1241
00:50:42,829 --> 00:50:39,420
and um

1242
00:50:44,450 --> 00:50:42,839
uh Richard says that the technology can

1243
00:50:45,589 --> 00:50:44,460
be used for psychological warfare

1244
00:50:47,450 --> 00:50:45,599
purposes

1245
00:50:48,770 --> 00:50:47,460
uh you could make someone think that

1246
00:50:50,930 --> 00:50:48,780
they're seeing things that aren't there

1247
00:50:52,490 --> 00:50:50,940
you can make a landscape appear that

1248
00:50:55,849 --> 00:50:52,500
wasn't there you can make people think

1249
00:50:58,309 --> 00:50:55,859
that a room is shrinking or growing

1250
00:50:59,870 --> 00:50:58,319
uh you could

1251
00:51:01,730 --> 00:50:59,880
uh

1252
00:51:03,530 --> 00:51:01,740
and he said that in the original patent

1253
00:51:05,150 --> 00:51:03,540
he included the psychological warfare

1254
00:51:07,250 --> 00:51:05,160
aspects of it as part of the original

1255
00:51:08,870 --> 00:51:07,260
patent and keep in mind Richard

1256
00:51:11,930 --> 00:51:08,880
Schoenberg is the first person to ever

1257
00:51:16,130 --> 00:51:11,940
be awarded the patent in this technology

1258
00:51:19,370 --> 00:51:16,140
uh he he says that um

1259
00:51:21,829 --> 00:51:19,380
he goes on to talk about how his intent

1260
00:51:24,650 --> 00:51:21,839
was to create something for soldiers to

1261
00:51:28,190 --> 00:51:24,660
use in the battlefield

1262
00:51:30,890 --> 00:51:28,200
um and that he and

1263
00:51:32,930 --> 00:51:30,900
psychological warfare

1264
00:51:34,849 --> 00:51:32,940
foreign dictators you know someone like

1265
00:51:37,309 --> 00:51:34,859
Fidel Castro he wasn't thinking of it

1266
00:51:40,430 --> 00:51:37,319
being used you know against the United

1267
00:51:42,470 --> 00:51:40,440
States civilians uh he's Challenger

1268
00:51:43,970 --> 00:51:42,480
won't be the first scientist naive

1269
00:51:48,230 --> 00:51:43,980
enough to think that the technology

1270
00:51:48,950 --> 00:51:48,240
wouldn't be used in in a serious manner

1271
00:51:52,490 --> 00:51:48,960
um

1272
00:51:54,109 --> 00:51:52,500
and uh so he he goes on and tells us all

1273
00:51:56,210 --> 00:51:54,119
this

1274
00:51:58,069 --> 00:51:56,220
yeah I'm I'm stunned

1275
00:51:59,270 --> 00:51:58,079
and I told Damien before and I go no

1276
00:52:02,750 --> 00:51:59,280
matter what happens don't say anything

1277
00:52:04,609 --> 00:52:02,760
just wait you know just

1278
00:52:06,710 --> 00:52:04,619
just wait until I tell you to tell him

1279
00:52:08,870 --> 00:52:06,720
the story so after about an hour and a

1280
00:52:11,750 --> 00:52:08,880
half of Richard talking I I say well

1281
00:52:13,549 --> 00:52:11,760
Damian has a story for you he has

1282
00:52:15,290 --> 00:52:13,559
something to tell you and I could tell

1283
00:52:17,089 --> 00:52:15,300
Richard looked a little like weary like

1284
00:52:18,710 --> 00:52:17,099
maybe we were gonna sandbag him with

1285
00:52:21,349 --> 00:52:18,720
something or like you know like what's

1286
00:52:23,089 --> 00:52:21,359
this now uh Damien starts telling him

1287
00:52:25,790 --> 00:52:23,099
the story

1288
00:52:27,349 --> 00:52:25,800
and you can read in the transcript in

1289
00:52:29,630 --> 00:52:27,359
the book that I kind of have to help

1290
00:52:31,010 --> 00:52:29,640
Damian out uh like Damien's telling the

1291
00:52:32,690 --> 00:52:31,020
story but I have to kind of like film in

1292
00:52:34,790 --> 00:52:32,700
details because you can tell that

1293
00:52:37,569 --> 00:52:34,800
Damien's

1294
00:52:40,849 --> 00:52:37,579
feeling like mind blown

1295
00:52:42,770 --> 00:52:40,859
that he's meeting the guy who created

1296
00:52:45,470 --> 00:52:42,780
the technology that's been used to

1297
00:52:50,210 --> 00:52:45,480
torture him uh for the past several

1298
00:52:52,190 --> 00:52:50,220
years and uh did Richard listened and at

1299
00:52:55,430 --> 00:52:52,200
first he seems a little weary a little

1300
00:52:58,910 --> 00:52:55,440
skeptical then when Damien hit the point

1301
00:53:01,069 --> 00:52:58,920
where he said I saw them briefly in the

1302
00:53:03,530 --> 00:53:01,079
mirror when it was in motion I could

1303
00:53:05,690 --> 00:53:03,540
tell Richard kind of leaned forward

1304
00:53:08,569 --> 00:53:05,700
seeing they'd be listening more intently

1305
00:53:11,089 --> 00:53:08,579
at that moment then when Damien said

1306
00:53:15,290 --> 00:53:11,099
sometimes I see them as these little

1307
00:53:17,030 --> 00:53:15,300
dots in the air uh he just he like

1308
00:53:19,069 --> 00:53:17,040
completely leaned forward at that point

1309
00:53:20,990 --> 00:53:19,079
and he goes that's exactly what the

1310
00:53:22,790 --> 00:53:21,000
technology looks like when it's not

1311
00:53:23,990 --> 00:53:22,800
being used properly

1312
00:53:26,150 --> 00:53:24,000
when they don't know what they're doing

1313
00:53:28,609 --> 00:53:26,160
that's what it looks like and you could

1314
00:53:30,589 --> 00:53:28,619
tell that he knew that Damien this is

1315
00:53:32,450 --> 00:53:30,599
not something Damien could have dreamed

1316
00:53:34,370 --> 00:53:32,460
up up top of his head he's not an

1317
00:53:36,829 --> 00:53:34,380
optical physicist there are only a few

1318
00:53:38,390 --> 00:53:36,839
people on the planet who worked with

1319
00:53:40,849 --> 00:53:38,400
this technology and Richard's one of

1320
00:53:43,190 --> 00:53:40,859
them and Richard knew that there's no

1321
00:53:45,589 --> 00:53:43,200
way Damien dreamed that up so from that

1322
00:53:47,450 --> 00:53:45,599
point on he absolutely just believed

1323
00:53:49,490 --> 00:53:47,460
everything Damien said and he and he

1324
00:53:51,530 --> 00:53:49,500
said by the end you can read this far in

1325
00:53:53,990 --> 00:53:51,540
the book he says I think that you were

1326
00:53:56,630 --> 00:53:54,000
used as a guinea pig for for my

1327
00:53:58,190 --> 00:53:56,640
technology they stole my technology they

1328
00:54:01,309 --> 00:53:58,200
decided they needed to test it on

1329
00:54:02,569 --> 00:54:01,319
someone and you're the person they chose

1330
00:54:05,089 --> 00:54:02,579
um and maybe you're not the only person

1331
00:54:07,970 --> 00:54:05,099
they chose

1332
00:54:11,270 --> 00:54:07,980
um obviously Damien pissed somebody off

1333
00:54:12,710 --> 00:54:11,280
when he wouldn't cooperate he went on

1334
00:54:15,530 --> 00:54:12,720
the list

1335
00:54:18,049 --> 00:54:15,540
and decided someone asked me at the time

1336
00:54:19,730 --> 00:54:18,059
I was talking to a colleague at CSU Long

1337
00:54:22,250 --> 00:54:19,740
Beach and she said no why won't they

1338
00:54:26,030 --> 00:54:22,260
just test this out at Camp Pendleton why

1339
00:54:28,849 --> 00:54:26,040
would they pick some random junkie to to

1340
00:54:31,430 --> 00:54:28,859
test us out on and I said you know what

1341
00:54:33,549 --> 00:54:31,440
it makes perfect sense you don't want to

1342
00:54:36,609 --> 00:54:33,559
test this in a controlled environment

1343
00:54:39,230 --> 00:54:36,619
you want to test this in a real

1344
00:54:40,930 --> 00:54:39,240
three-dimensional random setting on

1345
00:54:43,730 --> 00:54:40,940
someone who doesn't know what's going on

1346
00:54:45,950 --> 00:54:43,740
so that when you bring this technology

1347
00:54:48,049 --> 00:54:45,960
into the battlefield into a real

1348
00:54:49,910 --> 00:54:48,059
situation where people might die you

1349
00:54:52,549 --> 00:54:49,920
want to know beforehand when does the

1350
00:54:54,890 --> 00:54:52,559
subject realize that he's being

1351
00:54:56,089 --> 00:54:54,900
surveilled when does he realize that

1352
00:54:58,609 --> 00:54:56,099
there's someone else in the room with

1353
00:55:01,670 --> 00:54:58,619
him at what point does the technology

1354
00:55:04,309 --> 00:55:01,680
break down and he notices us you know

1355
00:55:07,309 --> 00:55:04,319
Damian didn't have a gun Damian didn't

1356
00:55:08,930 --> 00:55:07,319
have anything to defend himself uh you

1357
00:55:11,450 --> 00:55:08,940
want to know this before you send your

1358
00:55:13,430 --> 00:55:11,460
operatives into a battlefield kind of

1359
00:55:17,950 --> 00:55:13,440
situation

1360
00:55:23,750 --> 00:55:21,650
afterwards I thought that

1361
00:55:26,870 --> 00:55:23,760
hearing all this would have made Damien

1362
00:55:29,510 --> 00:55:26,880
feel better because obviously

1363
00:55:32,690 --> 00:55:29,520
now here's proof that he's not crazy

1364
00:55:34,970 --> 00:55:32,700
right but I in fact it had the exact

1365
00:55:35,990 --> 00:55:34,980
opposite effect I I think it caused him

1366
00:55:37,849 --> 00:55:36,000
to

1367
00:55:41,450 --> 00:55:37,859
he was holding out hope that he was

1368
00:55:43,430 --> 00:55:41,460
crazy because you can fix that with a

1369
00:55:45,730 --> 00:55:43,440
pill or

1370
00:55:49,730 --> 00:55:45,740
or the Long Hospital stay

1371
00:55:51,589 --> 00:55:49,740
you can take some pills and then reality

1372
00:55:54,410 --> 00:55:51,599
sorts itself out you can go about your

1373
00:56:00,049 --> 00:55:54,420
daily life that's the easy fix

1374
00:56:05,049 --> 00:56:02,210
that's uh and so when you realize that

1375
00:56:07,370 --> 00:56:05,059
he absolutely realized 100 I'm not crazy

1376
00:56:08,390 --> 00:56:07,380
uh I think that that made him like

1377
00:56:11,270 --> 00:56:08,400
really

1378
00:56:12,829 --> 00:56:11,280
this combobulated them to say the least

1379
00:56:14,930 --> 00:56:12,839
and

1380
00:56:17,930 --> 00:56:14,940
um I kind of lost touch with him soon

1381
00:56:19,910 --> 00:56:17,940
after that for a couple of years

1382
00:56:21,710 --> 00:56:19,920
and

1383
00:56:25,609 --> 00:56:21,720
um a shortened version of my interview

1384
00:56:29,510 --> 00:56:25,619
with Richard appeared in UFO magazine in

1385
00:56:30,890 --> 00:56:29,520
2007. I wanted it there because at first

1386
00:56:33,890 --> 00:56:30,900
you might say what does any of this have

1387
00:56:35,930 --> 00:56:33,900
to do with UFOs but it seemed to me when

1388
00:56:37,250 --> 00:56:35,940
Damien said oh you know if I didn't know

1389
00:56:39,770 --> 00:56:37,260
any better I would have thought my house

1390
00:56:41,329 --> 00:56:39,780
was haunted I had missing time maybe I

1391
00:56:42,890 --> 00:56:41,339
was being affected by aliens he actually

1392
00:56:44,630 --> 00:56:42,900
said that at one point

1393
00:56:46,190 --> 00:56:44,640
I would have thought I was being I was

1394
00:56:48,290 --> 00:56:46,200
an alien abductee if I didn't know any

1395
00:56:50,210 --> 00:56:48,300
better I thought I wanted this interview

1396
00:56:52,309 --> 00:56:50,220
to appear in UFO magazine so that the

1397
00:56:54,109 --> 00:56:52,319
people will read that magazine will read

1398
00:56:57,349 --> 00:56:54,119
it and maybe they'll stop and think

1399
00:57:00,049 --> 00:56:57,359
maybe I was abducted by aliens or maybe

1400
00:57:01,609 --> 00:57:00,059
something else is happening

1401
00:57:03,589 --> 00:57:01,619
um and the the person who published it

1402
00:57:06,650 --> 00:57:03,599
was um

1403
00:57:08,390 --> 00:57:06,660
um William Burns's uh wife Nancy Burns

1404
00:57:11,569 --> 00:57:08,400
William Burns who co-wrote the day after

1405
00:57:14,690 --> 00:57:11,579
Roswell with Phil Corso his wife Nancy

1406
00:57:16,910 --> 00:57:14,700
was editing UFO magazine and uh she's

1407
00:57:21,230 --> 00:57:16,920
the one who published the excerpt

1408
00:57:22,549 --> 00:57:21,240
and um then I lost touch with Damian for

1409
00:57:25,910 --> 00:57:22,559
a while

1410
00:57:27,770 --> 00:57:25,920
I moved on and I tried to actually push

1411
00:57:31,069 --> 00:57:27,780
all this out of my mind

1412
00:57:33,470 --> 00:57:31,079
uh because it was just too difficult to

1413
00:57:36,049 --> 00:57:33,480
deal with and I thought it was

1414
00:57:37,910 --> 00:57:36,059
interesting later on in retrospect that

1415
00:57:39,950 --> 00:57:37,920
the same amount of years I took away

1416
00:57:40,849 --> 00:57:39,960
from it before Whiting Camellia I wrote

1417
00:57:50,750 --> 00:57:40,859
the

1418
00:57:52,670 --> 00:57:50,760
uh so that was several years after all

1419
00:57:53,870 --> 00:57:52,680
this had happened later on one of my

1420
00:57:56,329 --> 00:57:53,880
favorite books of all time is The

1421
00:57:59,270 --> 00:57:56,339
Mothman Prophecies by Johnny Keel which

1422
00:58:03,049 --> 00:57:59,280
I discovered when I was like 19. maybe

1423
00:58:04,970 --> 00:58:03,059
maybe 18. and uh

1424
00:58:06,589 --> 00:58:04,980
it was the same amount of years I don't

1425
00:58:08,510 --> 00:58:06,599
know if it was seven or eight but

1426
00:58:09,950 --> 00:58:08,520
between the time that John Keel

1427
00:58:13,130 --> 00:58:09,960
experienced all that stuff in West

1428
00:58:14,690 --> 00:58:13,140
Virginia in in Point Pleasant and the

1429
00:58:17,150 --> 00:58:14,700
time that he sat down to write it I

1430
00:58:19,370 --> 00:58:17,160
think it was about seven years or so

1431
00:58:20,750 --> 00:58:19,380
because all the how all that stuff that

1432
00:58:24,290 --> 00:58:20,760
happened in Point Pleasant happened in

1433
00:58:27,109 --> 00:58:24,300
like 67 I think 67 68 then the book

1434
00:58:29,870 --> 00:58:27,119
doesn't come out until like a decade

1435
00:58:31,670 --> 00:58:29,880
later uh and I realized that he said

1436
00:58:33,770 --> 00:58:31,680
John Keel said he just tried to push it

1437
00:58:35,150 --> 00:58:33,780
all out of his mind and move on to other

1438
00:58:37,370 --> 00:58:35,160
things because he couldn't really handle

1439
00:58:39,049 --> 00:58:37,380
thinking about it so it took him a while

1440
00:58:41,630 --> 00:58:39,059
to come back actually sort through all

1441
00:58:44,450 --> 00:58:41,640
of his notes and I had a bunch of notes

1442
00:58:47,510 --> 00:58:44,460
I I can identify with that there's a

1443
00:58:49,849 --> 00:58:47,520
website uh I can't remember the title

1444
00:58:52,010 --> 00:58:49,859
but it's it's all it's John Keel it's a

1445
00:58:55,250 --> 00:58:52,020
website entirely devoted to archiving

1446
00:58:57,950 --> 00:58:55,260
John keel's notes and stuff and uh you

1447
00:59:01,010 --> 00:58:57,960
can see what a a copious Note Taker he

1448
00:59:03,589 --> 00:59:01,020
was like if you think that John Keel is

1449
00:59:05,270 --> 00:59:03,599
making stuff up off top of his head you

1450
00:59:07,970 --> 00:59:05,280
can see like all the notes he was taking

1451
00:59:10,670 --> 00:59:07,980
at that time from which the manuscript

1452
00:59:12,890 --> 00:59:10,680
was created well I have I had notes and

1453
00:59:15,770 --> 00:59:12,900
notes and notebooks I had I had taped

1454
00:59:18,770 --> 00:59:15,780
myself talking to Damien I taped myself

1455
00:59:20,390 --> 00:59:18,780
talking to other people about it so I

1456
00:59:23,870 --> 00:59:20,400
was able go back and listen to those

1457
00:59:26,089 --> 00:59:23,880
tapes and and lock down exact dates when

1458
00:59:27,950 --> 00:59:26,099
things had happened I'm so glad I did

1459
00:59:30,710 --> 00:59:27,960
that because otherwise after a few years

1460
00:59:33,289 --> 00:59:30,720
you might forget those details

1461
00:59:35,690 --> 00:59:33,299
so after some time it passed I was able

1462
00:59:38,329 --> 00:59:35,700
to sit down and it was it was all

1463
00:59:40,609 --> 00:59:38,339
sparked off by I was teaching the

1464
00:59:43,069 --> 00:59:40,619
literature of Science Fiction at CSU

1465
00:59:44,990 --> 00:59:43,079
Long Beach and one day

1466
00:59:46,670 --> 00:59:45,000
after class A student stopped me in the

1467
00:59:48,349 --> 00:59:46,680
hallway and he said hey he goes can you

1468
00:59:51,230 --> 00:59:48,359
think of something that we consider to

1469
00:59:52,730 --> 00:59:51,240
be science fiction but it isn't and I

1470
00:59:55,190 --> 00:59:52,740
immediately came back with oh

1471
00:59:56,870 --> 00:59:55,200
invisibility technology and I start

1472
00:59:59,270 --> 00:59:56,880
telling him

1473
01:00:01,970 --> 00:59:59,280
like everything I just told you that was

1474
01:00:04,010 --> 01:00:01,980
a shortened version of that and his jaw

1475
01:00:05,750 --> 01:00:04,020
is like dropping onto the ground

1476
01:00:07,910 --> 01:00:05,760
standing there in the hallway outside

1477
01:00:09,710 --> 01:00:07,920
the classroom and he goes can you tell

1478
01:00:13,130 --> 01:00:09,720
the story to the class like next time we

1479
01:00:15,349 --> 01:00:13,140
meet I go sure remind me he he leaves I

1480
01:00:17,870 --> 01:00:15,359
immediately sat down pulled a notebook

1481
01:00:19,789 --> 01:00:17,880
out of my bag and crouched down the

1482
01:00:21,170 --> 01:00:19,799
hallway there and I wrote out in bullet

1483
01:00:22,789 --> 01:00:21,180
notes everything I had just told them

1484
01:00:25,549 --> 01:00:22,799
and the order that I told it to him

1485
01:00:26,930 --> 01:00:25,559
because it was so it's such a bizarre

1486
01:00:29,030 --> 01:00:26,940
story filled with synchronicity

1487
01:00:31,990 --> 01:00:29,040
coincidence

1488
01:00:36,589 --> 01:00:32,000
overlapping

1489
01:00:38,750 --> 01:00:36,599
Baroque spirals of synchronicity is

1490
01:00:40,670 --> 01:00:38,760
to know where do you begin telling the

1491
01:00:42,349 --> 01:00:40,680
story where do you end it

1492
01:00:44,030 --> 01:00:42,359
I just wrote down on bullet points

1493
01:00:47,450 --> 01:00:44,040
everything I told them and that became

1494
01:00:49,069 --> 01:00:47,460
the outline for camellio that that page

1495
01:00:51,589 --> 01:00:49,079
or two pages that I wrote standing in

1496
01:00:53,030 --> 01:00:51,599
the hallway became the outline

1497
01:00:55,069 --> 01:00:53,040
um it's almost like Phil dick talking

1498
01:00:56,450 --> 01:00:55,079
about writing the book of Alice where he

1499
01:00:58,069 --> 01:00:56,460
said it was so complex he didn't know

1500
01:00:59,450 --> 01:00:58,079
where to begin and eventually it just

1501
01:01:01,430 --> 01:00:59,460
came to him one day oh I just have to

1502
01:01:03,890 --> 01:01:01,440
write down exactly what happened

1503
01:01:04,970 --> 01:01:03,900
uh it seems kind of like simplistic like

1504
01:01:07,430 --> 01:01:04,980
obvious

1505
01:01:09,109 --> 01:01:07,440
but but it was like oh yeah I should

1506
01:01:10,670 --> 01:01:09,119
just write it down exactly the way I

1507
01:01:12,710 --> 01:01:10,680
told this guy in the hall

1508
01:01:14,329 --> 01:01:12,720
you know I was able to communicate to

1509
01:01:17,270 --> 01:01:14,339
him exactly what happened he understood

1510
01:01:19,549 --> 01:01:17,280
it so I'll just write it that way

1511
01:01:20,870 --> 01:01:19,559
um next day when we were in class he

1512
01:01:23,510 --> 01:01:20,880
said to me hey you're gonna tell that

1513
01:01:24,710 --> 01:01:23,520
story so I told this the story to the

1514
01:01:27,230 --> 01:01:24,720
class

1515
01:01:29,030 --> 01:01:27,240
they're staring at me blind guide

1516
01:01:32,329 --> 01:01:29,040
just so happened there was a guy in the

1517
01:01:36,230 --> 01:01:32,339
class who was ROTC so he'd come to class

1518
01:01:38,089 --> 01:01:36,240
every day in full military gear

1519
01:01:42,170 --> 01:01:38,099
and he he would always

1520
01:01:44,390 --> 01:01:42,180
address me respectfully oh sir professor

1521
01:01:45,349 --> 01:01:44,400
uh he'd raise his hand sir may I say

1522
01:01:49,970 --> 01:01:45,359
something

1523
01:01:52,789 --> 01:01:49,980
uh and I'm telling the story he raises

1524
01:01:55,609 --> 01:01:52,799
his hand rails straight into the air and

1525
01:01:57,410 --> 01:01:55,619
says sir uh may I make a comment yes you

1526
01:01:59,930 --> 01:01:57,420
may he says

1527
01:02:03,289 --> 01:01:59,940
um I now I can't I can't say everything

1528
01:02:06,910 --> 01:02:03,299
that I know but during my R2 ROTC

1529
01:02:09,170 --> 01:02:06,920
training I was told things that a line

1530
01:02:10,789 --> 01:02:09,180
eerily with everything you've said

1531
01:02:12,530 --> 01:02:10,799
during this classroom that's all I can

1532
01:02:16,309 --> 01:02:12,540
say

1533
01:02:18,950 --> 01:02:16,319
and and everyone in the class was uh

1534
01:02:22,970 --> 01:02:18,960
suddenly believing me now uh maybe a

1535
01:02:25,670 --> 01:02:22,980
little bit more than than before uh so

1536
01:02:27,530 --> 01:02:25,680
you know if I hadn't had if I hadn't

1537
01:02:29,150 --> 01:02:27,540
been teaching that particular class if

1538
01:02:31,430 --> 01:02:29,160
the guy hadn't asked me that question at

1539
01:02:32,750 --> 01:02:31,440
that time would would have taken me

1540
01:02:34,730 --> 01:02:32,760
several more years to get around to

1541
01:02:36,829 --> 01:02:34,740
writing it you know I I don't know it's

1542
01:02:39,170 --> 01:02:36,839
just one of those bizarre things

1543
01:02:41,089 --> 01:02:39,180
uh and and so

1544
01:02:45,410 --> 01:02:41,099
eventually the book was published by or

1545
01:02:48,170 --> 01:02:45,420
books in in New York uh and um I knew it

1546
01:02:51,109 --> 01:02:48,180
was like throwing a message in a bottle

1547
01:02:52,849 --> 01:02:51,119
like out into the ocean I knew that

1548
01:02:54,829 --> 01:02:52,859
other people would have experienced

1549
01:02:57,770 --> 01:02:54,839
these types of things and would get in

1550
01:02:59,750 --> 01:02:57,780
contact me with me and they have

1551
01:03:02,510 --> 01:02:59,760
um and I've I've written follow-up

1552
01:03:04,430 --> 01:03:02,520
articles I had an article published in

1553
01:03:07,849 --> 01:03:04,440
Nexus magazine earlier this year called

1554
01:03:10,190 --> 01:03:07,859
invisible Predators which is kind of a a

1555
01:03:12,349 --> 01:03:10,200
follow-up to camellio I've also

1556
01:03:14,870 --> 01:03:12,359
published a follow-up interview with

1557
01:03:18,170 --> 01:03:14,880
Richard shoner also on Nexus magazine in

1558
01:03:20,329 --> 01:03:18,180
2016 uh where I the entire subject of

1559
01:03:23,930 --> 01:03:20,339
the interview is just

1560
01:03:26,630 --> 01:03:23,940
um what what was his inspiration

1561
01:03:28,069 --> 01:03:26,640
creating the technology and in the

1562
01:03:30,770 --> 01:03:28,079
interview he goes into great detail

1563
01:03:32,510 --> 01:03:30,780
saying uh well one of The Inspirations

1564
01:03:35,569 --> 01:03:32,520
was that when he was stationed on the

1565
01:03:37,069 --> 01:03:35,579
island of Guam in the 50s when he first

1566
01:03:41,510 --> 01:03:37,079
joined the military

1567
01:03:43,849 --> 01:03:41,520
he uh was initiated into the recruitions

1568
01:03:46,609 --> 01:03:43,859
and the rosicrucians talk a lot about

1569
01:03:48,650 --> 01:03:46,619
these ascended masters who can make who

1570
01:03:51,289 --> 01:03:48,660
could go invisible kind of like the

1571
01:03:53,809 --> 01:03:51,299
Shadow the pulp hero from the 30s he

1572
01:03:55,609 --> 01:03:53,819
could hypnotize Cloud men's Minds so

1573
01:03:58,130 --> 01:03:55,619
they could not see him

1574
01:03:59,750 --> 01:03:58,140
and that's what there are these legends

1575
01:04:01,849 --> 01:03:59,760
about these rules secretion ascended

1576
01:04:04,130 --> 01:04:01,859
masters who could who could do this and

1577
01:04:06,470 --> 01:04:04,140
that intrigued him then later on a

1578
01:04:08,630 --> 01:04:06,480
decade later in the late 60s he starts

1579
01:04:11,270 --> 01:04:08,640
Richard starts getting into UFOs reading

1580
01:04:12,829 --> 01:04:11,280
UFO books following the reports he was

1581
01:04:14,270 --> 01:04:12,839
fascinated by the fact that a lot of

1582
01:04:16,430 --> 01:04:14,280
these Witnesses would say that they

1583
01:04:19,190 --> 01:04:16,440
would suddenly either zip away

1584
01:04:22,069 --> 01:04:19,200
in a blink of an eye or or shift into

1585
01:04:24,470 --> 01:04:22,079
another dimension or cloak themselves

1586
01:04:26,150 --> 01:04:24,480
with some sort of invisibility cloak and

1587
01:04:28,130 --> 01:04:26,160
that fascinated him and Richard started

1588
01:04:29,630 --> 01:04:28,140
thinking how would we replicate that

1589
01:04:31,430 --> 01:04:29,640
kind of Technology with what we have

1590
01:04:34,849 --> 01:04:31,440
available to us now

1591
01:04:37,490 --> 01:04:34,859
uh so in a way the project camellio

1592
01:04:38,990 --> 01:04:37,500
which was his own personal project I

1593
01:04:40,789 --> 01:04:39,000
should point out he had a top secret

1594
01:04:42,289 --> 01:04:40,799
clearance he worked for Northrop Grumman

1595
01:04:44,030 --> 01:04:42,299
for years he worked for the military for

1596
01:04:46,370 --> 01:04:44,040
years this was something that was

1597
01:04:47,390 --> 01:04:46,380
personal project that he initiated on

1598
01:04:49,250 --> 01:04:47,400
his own

1599
01:04:51,170 --> 01:04:49,260
uh and

1600
01:04:52,730 --> 01:04:51,180
so Camellia was kind of like the cargo

1601
01:04:55,549 --> 01:04:52,740
cult version

1602
01:04:58,190 --> 01:04:55,559
of of a phenomenon that already existed

1603
01:04:59,870 --> 01:04:58,200
like in those old Tarzan movies where

1604
01:05:01,250 --> 01:04:59,880
the natives see the plane and the sky

1605
01:05:03,829 --> 01:05:01,260
and then they build a plane out of

1606
01:05:05,809 --> 01:05:03,839
bamboo and worship it like a god that's

1607
01:05:09,589 --> 01:05:05,819
what you know Richard's hearing these

1608
01:05:11,150 --> 01:05:09,599
UFO reports listening to them uh paying

1609
01:05:12,890 --> 01:05:11,160
a lot of attention to them and thinking

1610
01:05:13,789 --> 01:05:12,900
how would you replicate that with what

1611
01:05:15,170 --> 01:05:13,799
we have

1612
01:05:16,609 --> 01:05:15,180
so

1613
01:05:18,710 --> 01:05:16,619
uh

1614
01:05:20,630 --> 01:05:18,720
that's what then in the article I wrote

1615
01:05:22,250 --> 01:05:20,640
invisible Prejudice for Nexus was was

1616
01:05:23,990 --> 01:05:22,260
all about

1617
01:05:26,990 --> 01:05:24,000
trying to separate the wheat from the

1618
01:05:29,390 --> 01:05:27,000
chaff because I've had I I've met I did

1619
01:05:31,609 --> 01:05:29,400
a signing for Camellia at Skylight books

1620
01:05:32,990 --> 01:05:31,619
in LA and this one woman came up to me

1621
01:05:35,030 --> 01:05:33,000
he wanted me to sign the books I signed

1622
01:05:37,549 --> 01:05:35,040
it I drew a picture of a UFO

1623
01:05:40,010 --> 01:05:37,559
under my signature and she goes could

1624
01:05:43,450 --> 01:05:40,020
you write uh

1625
01:05:45,950 --> 01:05:43,460
it was like could you write um

1626
01:05:48,950 --> 01:05:45,960
uh Arrow form you know top secret

1627
01:05:50,390 --> 01:05:48,960
aeroform platform underneath that and I

1628
01:05:53,270 --> 01:05:50,400
said why she goes I don't believe in

1629
01:05:55,190 --> 01:05:53,280
UFOs you know I go okay so I wrote top

1630
01:05:57,589 --> 01:05:55,200
secret you know

1631
01:06:00,049 --> 01:05:57,599
aeroform platform under under the

1632
01:06:01,069 --> 01:06:00,059
drawing of the UFO uh with an arrow

1633
01:06:02,270 --> 01:06:01,079
pointing at it

1634
01:06:04,609 --> 01:06:02,280
uh

1635
01:06:08,349 --> 01:06:04,619
but there are people who they think well

1636
01:06:12,049 --> 01:06:08,359
all this stuff is just top secret

1637
01:06:14,630 --> 01:06:12,059
uh experimental research you know every

1638
01:06:17,750 --> 01:06:14,640
single alien abduction every single UFO

1639
01:06:19,609 --> 01:06:17,760
sighting all of it is just this type of

1640
01:06:23,329 --> 01:06:19,619
technology which

1641
01:06:25,370 --> 01:06:23,339
is is going to like

1642
01:06:27,950 --> 01:06:25,380
an extreme

1643
01:06:28,910 --> 01:06:27,960
oh I think the real answer is if some of

1644
01:06:31,190 --> 01:06:28,920
it is

1645
01:06:32,630 --> 01:06:31,200
but there's a lot of it that's not uh

1646
01:06:35,109 --> 01:06:32,640
because if you go back to the books of

1647
01:06:37,849 --> 01:06:35,119
Charles Fort you know he's talking about

1648
01:06:41,150 --> 01:06:37,859
invisible beings leaving cloven Hooves

1649
01:06:43,970 --> 01:06:41,160
in the snow in Germany in 1899 or

1650
01:06:45,650 --> 01:06:43,980
whatever you know that's not that's not

1651
01:06:47,650 --> 01:06:45,660
saic

1652
01:06:50,630 --> 01:06:47,660
that's not that's not the military

1653
01:06:53,390 --> 01:06:50,640
experimenting with something in 1899

1654
01:06:55,430 --> 01:06:53,400
uh that's a pre-existing phenomenon and

1655
01:06:57,289 --> 01:06:55,440
so uh the point of the invisible

1656
01:06:59,450 --> 01:06:57,299
Predators article is to say yes there is

1657
01:07:02,390 --> 01:06:59,460
this phenomenon and then there is this

1658
01:07:05,690 --> 01:07:02,400
cargo cult version of it created in the

1659
01:07:08,410 --> 01:07:05,700
latter half of the of the 20th century

1660
01:07:14,210 --> 01:07:08,420
um and and it really begins to be

1661
01:07:17,750 --> 01:07:14,220
exploited and used on U.S citizens and

1662
01:07:22,329 --> 01:07:17,760
other people around the world post

1663
01:07:25,730 --> 01:07:22,339
9 11 post-patriate act let's say

1664
01:07:28,430 --> 01:07:25,740
completely and that invisible predator's

1665
01:07:31,370 --> 01:07:28,440
article that's a great article great

1666
01:07:35,029 --> 01:07:31,380
title too and I think it's just amazing

1667
01:07:36,710 --> 01:07:35,039
the these coincidental or synchronistic

1668
01:07:39,349 --> 01:07:36,720
events much like

1669
01:07:41,690 --> 01:07:39,359
being able to meet up with the inventor

1670
01:07:43,430 --> 01:07:41,700
of the optical camouflage or the

1671
01:07:48,549 --> 01:07:43,440
invisible suit the genius Richard

1672
01:07:51,109 --> 01:07:48,559
Schoenberg these things oftentimes are

1673
01:07:55,730 --> 01:07:51,119
coincidentally happening at the same

1674
01:07:57,950 --> 01:07:55,740
time much like saic and

1675
01:08:00,890 --> 01:07:57,960
um the building that is across the

1676
01:08:03,410 --> 01:08:00,900
street from it there in San Diego and I

1677
01:08:05,750 --> 01:08:03,420
want to get to that but bringing this to

1678
01:08:08,690 --> 01:08:05,760
the Forefront of the high strangeness in

1679
01:08:10,910 --> 01:08:08,700
the Uinta Basin Colonel John Alexander

1680
01:08:13,010 --> 01:08:10,920
who worked with nids or Bigelow's

1681
01:08:16,490 --> 01:08:13,020
science team has been called the father

1682
01:08:19,550 --> 01:08:16,500
of non-lethal weaponry and saic which

1683
01:08:21,950 --> 01:08:19,560
I'm glad you mentioned has dealt with

1684
01:08:24,590 --> 01:08:21,960
research and development of non-lethal

1685
01:08:26,030 --> 01:08:24,600
weaponry and has a long history of

1686
01:08:29,030 --> 01:08:26,040
working with the intelligence Community

1687
01:08:31,249 --> 01:08:29,040
the Department of Defense and in the

1688
01:08:33,289 --> 01:08:31,259
book hunt for the skinwalker by George

1689
01:08:37,070 --> 01:08:33,299
Knapp and Colin Kelleher

1690
01:08:39,470 --> 01:08:37,080
they mention an event when an interested

1691
01:08:42,169 --> 01:08:39,480
researcher in front of Terry Sherman the

1692
01:08:44,450 --> 01:08:42,179
ranch owner sat in a field and began

1693
01:08:47,269 --> 01:08:44,460
meditating moments later what can only

1694
01:08:49,849 --> 01:08:47,279
be described as an invisible entity

1695
01:08:53,269 --> 01:08:49,859
which blurred the background behind its

1696
01:08:57,050 --> 01:08:53,279
body shape outline ran up to the guy

1697
01:09:00,410 --> 01:08:57,060
meditating and screamed and the entity

1698
01:09:02,209 --> 01:09:00,420
was most closely described as you know

1699
01:09:03,950 --> 01:09:02,219
those scenes from the movie Predator

1700
01:09:05,450 --> 01:09:03,960
like an invisible Predator where the

1701
01:09:07,010 --> 01:09:05,460
Predator goes into this blurry

1702
01:09:09,650 --> 01:09:07,020
invisibility mode

1703
01:09:12,470 --> 01:09:09,660
and how far-fetched is it Robert to

1704
01:09:14,930 --> 01:09:12,480
believe as nap and Kelleher have said

1705
01:09:17,450 --> 01:09:14,940
that some of the high strangeness in

1706
01:09:19,189 --> 01:09:17,460
these places are of man-made origin and

1707
01:09:21,769 --> 01:09:19,199
I was hoping you could tell our

1708
01:09:30,590 --> 01:09:21,779
listeners what lies across the street

1709
01:09:35,510 --> 01:09:32,329
right that's changed that's right they

1710
01:09:37,070 --> 01:09:35,520
split that's right because I'm trying to

1711
01:09:40,309 --> 01:09:37,080
remember what year this was I think it

1712
01:09:42,590 --> 01:09:40,319
was the summer of 2008. my friend and I

1713
01:09:44,689 --> 01:09:42,600
uh drove down to Pacific Beach we

1714
01:09:46,910 --> 01:09:44,699
actually went back to

1715
01:09:49,610 --> 01:09:46,920
uh Damien's apartment

1716
01:09:52,249 --> 01:09:49,620
and then we followed the route from the

1717
01:09:53,749 --> 01:09:52,259
apartment to saic and it was you know

1718
01:09:57,229 --> 01:09:53,759
you could walk it

1719
01:09:59,209 --> 01:09:57,239
uh and and uh faic at that time was

1720
01:10:01,030 --> 01:09:59,219
located right across the street from the

1721
01:10:05,390 --> 01:10:01,040
Whaley House

1722
01:10:08,930 --> 01:10:05,400
w-h-a-l-e-y which I I went in

1723
01:10:11,450 --> 01:10:08,940
I visited the Whaley House in 2005.

1724
01:10:13,490 --> 01:10:11,460
I have photos of me and my girlfriend at

1725
01:10:17,709 --> 01:10:13,500
the time wandering around the Whaley

1726
01:10:21,110 --> 01:10:17,719
House the Whaley House is uh uh a legend

1727
01:10:23,810 --> 01:10:21,120
among paranormal researchers in Southern

1728
01:10:25,669 --> 01:10:23,820
California it's it's known to be the

1729
01:10:28,189 --> 01:10:25,679
considered to be the most haunted house

1730
01:10:30,290 --> 01:10:28,199
in California

1731
01:10:33,970 --> 01:10:30,300
um and it's located in the in the old

1732
01:10:37,130 --> 01:10:33,980
town District of San Diego

1733
01:10:39,590 --> 01:10:37,140
right across from where

1734
01:10:42,830 --> 01:10:39,600
cic was built so then you begin to

1735
01:10:43,850 --> 01:10:42,840
wonder did they build it there for a

1736
01:10:45,290 --> 01:10:43,860
reason

1737
01:10:47,330 --> 01:10:45,300
you know did they build it there because

1738
01:10:48,890 --> 01:10:47,340
there's something special about that

1739
01:10:51,590 --> 01:10:48,900
geography

1740
01:10:53,149 --> 01:10:51,600
that causes the kind of paranormal

1741
01:10:56,149 --> 01:10:53,159
phenomenon that we see at a place called

1742
01:10:58,310 --> 01:10:56,159
Whaley House or because they build it

1743
01:10:59,930 --> 01:10:58,320
there because if they're experimenting

1744
01:11:02,149 --> 01:10:59,940
with weird technology

1745
01:11:03,709 --> 01:11:02,159
you wouldn't notice it because you would

1746
01:11:06,050 --> 01:11:03,719
just oh well that's that isn't that

1747
01:11:08,330 --> 01:11:06,060
where the Whaley House is all kinds of

1748
01:11:12,770 --> 01:11:08,340
weird ghostly stuff happens there right

1749
01:11:16,550 --> 01:11:12,780
and you just shrug and uh move on

1750
01:11:20,090 --> 01:11:18,410
um certainly you know John Keel and

1751
01:11:21,530 --> 01:11:20,100
Mothman Prophecies talks about these

1752
01:11:23,330 --> 01:11:21,540
window areas

1753
01:11:25,970 --> 01:11:23,340
you know

1754
01:11:29,270 --> 01:11:25,980
um uh there's a book by Bruce Kathy

1755
01:11:33,050 --> 01:11:29,280
called the harmonic convergence of space

1756
01:11:36,590 --> 01:11:33,060
uh Kathy c a t h i e

1757
01:11:38,990 --> 01:11:36,600
um uh which is all about these uh what

1758
01:11:40,610 --> 01:11:39,000
what Keel would call a window area

1759
01:11:46,130 --> 01:11:40,620
uh

1760
01:11:48,169 --> 01:11:46,140
is is writing about hyperdimensional

1761
01:11:49,669 --> 01:11:48,179
physics essentially but really it's the

1762
01:11:52,790 --> 01:11:49,679
same thing

1763
01:11:57,229 --> 01:11:52,800
and so do these corporations build on

1764
01:11:59,990 --> 01:11:57,239
particular plots of land for this reason

1765
01:12:03,830 --> 01:12:00,000
um is is something like Skinwalker Ranch

1766
01:12:05,390 --> 01:12:03,840
being used to experiment with this kind

1767
01:12:10,189 --> 01:12:05,400
of Technology because then it can just

1768
01:12:13,430 --> 01:12:10,199
be blamed on the Native American legends

1769
01:12:17,750 --> 01:12:13,440
of the of that area

1770
01:12:19,610 --> 01:12:17,760
um certainly I uh I I ended up on I've

1771
01:12:21,890 --> 01:12:19,620
been on coast to coast twice

1772
01:12:23,450 --> 01:12:21,900
which door with George Knapp

1773
01:12:26,090 --> 01:12:23,460
talking about the similarities between

1774
01:12:28,310 --> 01:12:26,100
Camelio and hunt for the skinwalker and

1775
01:12:31,010 --> 01:12:28,320
there are many strange similarities if

1776
01:12:34,729 --> 01:12:31,020
you read the two back to back

1777
01:12:37,669 --> 01:12:34,739
um you'll see these coincidences begin

1778
01:12:39,110 --> 01:12:37,679
to form between the two narratives

1779
01:12:42,830 --> 01:12:39,120
um and the reason I ended up on the show

1780
01:12:45,770 --> 01:12:42,840
is because Jacques La Red camellio and

1781
01:12:49,850 --> 01:12:45,780
recommended it to Colm Kelleher snaps

1782
01:12:52,010 --> 01:12:49,860
co-author uh who co-wrote hunt for the

1783
01:12:53,810 --> 01:12:52,020
skinwalker and Kelleher called George

1784
01:12:55,729 --> 01:12:53,820
Knapp and said you got to have this guy

1785
01:12:58,610 --> 01:12:55,739
on you got to read this book

1786
01:13:00,649 --> 01:12:58,620
subsequent to that after I was on the

1787
01:13:02,870 --> 01:13:00,659
show George Knapp

1788
01:13:04,910 --> 01:13:02,880
uh I guess contacted David politis and

1789
01:13:07,070 --> 01:13:04,920
said you need to read this book Emilio

1790
01:13:08,270 --> 01:13:07,080
and I've been contacted by a lot of

1791
01:13:10,189 --> 01:13:08,280
people who said they bought the book

1792
01:13:14,870 --> 01:13:10,199
because they've heard politis mentioned

1793
01:13:17,689 --> 01:13:14,880
it so many times in interviews

1794
01:13:21,830 --> 01:13:17,699
um uh because it overlaps in a weird way

1795
01:13:26,209 --> 01:13:23,209
um and when you when you mention John

1796
01:13:28,850 --> 01:13:26,219
Alexander it's interesting

1797
01:13:30,770 --> 01:13:28,860
I recommend taking a look at an article

1798
01:13:34,910 --> 01:13:30,780
that you can find on the Washington Post

1799
01:13:36,770 --> 01:13:34,920
that was published January 14th 2007.

1800
01:13:38,510 --> 01:13:36,780
so this would have been about

1801
01:13:41,030 --> 01:13:38,520
six months after I interviewed Richard

1802
01:13:44,510 --> 01:13:41,040
for the first time and the article is

1803
01:13:46,669 --> 01:13:44,520
called Mind Games new on the Internet by

1804
01:13:50,290 --> 01:13:46,679
Sharon Weinberger it's kind of a weird

1805
01:13:52,550 --> 01:13:50,300
title Mind Games new on the internet

1806
01:13:55,490 --> 01:13:52,560
Sharon Weinberger Washington Post

1807
01:13:58,790 --> 01:13:55,500
January 14 2007 and it's all about

1808
01:14:01,610 --> 01:13:58,800
Harlan Gerard now holler and Gerard is

1809
01:14:03,610 --> 01:14:01,620
kind of a uh

1810
01:14:06,770 --> 01:14:03,620
obscure figure

1811
01:14:09,229 --> 01:14:06,780
but Carlin Gerard claimed back in the

1812
01:14:12,250 --> 01:14:09,239
late 80s early 90s that he was the

1813
01:14:15,250 --> 01:14:12,260
victim of electronic harassment

1814
01:14:20,750 --> 01:14:15,260
unconstitutional surveillance

1815
01:14:23,450 --> 01:14:20,760
because of a a coincidental meeting uh

1816
01:14:27,410 --> 01:14:23,460
where he said negative things about

1817
01:14:29,450 --> 01:14:27,420
George H.W bush to someone he shouldn't

1818
01:14:33,830 --> 01:14:29,460
have said that to and then suddenly he

1819
01:14:35,810 --> 01:14:33,840
found himself the victim of this of this

1820
01:14:37,970 --> 01:14:35,820
um unconstitutional surveillance and

1821
01:14:40,430 --> 01:14:37,980
harassment and and it's a really good

1822
01:14:44,090 --> 01:14:40,440
article it's it's interesting how it it

1823
01:14:48,350 --> 01:14:45,950
the first sentence of the article is if

1824
01:14:49,970 --> 01:14:48,360
Harlan Gerard is crazy he doesn't act

1825
01:14:52,610 --> 01:14:49,980
the part

1826
01:14:54,530 --> 01:14:52,620
so it's and then the headline says Mind

1827
01:14:55,669 --> 01:14:54,540
Games new on the internet a community of

1828
01:14:57,830 --> 01:14:55,679
people who believe the government is

1829
01:15:00,169 --> 01:14:57,840
beaming voices into their minds they may

1830
01:15:01,970 --> 01:15:00,179
be crazy but the pentagonists pursued a

1831
01:15:05,090 --> 01:15:01,980
weapon that can do just that

1832
01:15:07,189 --> 01:15:05,100
so it's it's constantly like uh hitching

1833
01:15:08,810 --> 01:15:07,199
its bets it'll say this guy could be

1834
01:15:11,390 --> 01:15:08,820
crazy but and then it'll go into great

1835
01:15:13,010 --> 01:15:11,400
detail showing how he's not

1836
01:15:14,750 --> 01:15:13,020
um but what's fascinating is in the

1837
01:15:18,709 --> 01:15:14,760
middle of the article and it's a very

1838
01:15:20,630 --> 01:15:18,719
long article uh the reporter Sharon

1839
01:15:22,490 --> 01:15:20,640
Weinberger meets with

1840
01:15:25,189 --> 01:15:22,500
John Alexander

1841
01:15:26,689 --> 01:15:25,199
a week before the TI's targeted

1842
01:15:28,790 --> 01:15:26,699
individuals rallying on the National

1843
01:15:31,610 --> 01:15:28,800
Mall John Alexander one of the people

1844
01:15:33,470 --> 01:15:31,620
whom Harlan Gerard holds personally

1845
01:15:35,570 --> 01:15:33,480
responsible for the voices in his head

1846
01:15:38,090 --> 01:15:35,580
is at a Chili's restaurant in Crystal

1847
01:15:40,250 --> 01:15:38,100
City explaining where Philly cheese

1848
01:15:42,649 --> 01:15:40,260
steak and fries by the United States

1849
01:15:45,169 --> 01:15:42,659
needs mind control weapons

1850
01:15:47,689 --> 01:15:45,179
and he goes on to say

1851
01:15:48,530 --> 01:15:47,699
um let me read you a brief excerpt from

1852
01:15:50,330 --> 01:15:48,540
this

1853
01:15:52,850 --> 01:15:50,340
says in an earlier phone conversation

1854
01:15:54,830 --> 01:15:52,860
Alexander said that in the 1990s when he

1855
01:15:56,950 --> 01:15:54,840
took part in briefings at the CIA there

1856
01:16:00,350 --> 01:15:56,960
was never any talk of quote mind control

1857
01:16:02,750 --> 01:16:00,360
or mind-altering drugs or Technologies

1858
01:16:04,430 --> 01:16:02,760
or anything like that unquote according

1859
01:16:06,229 --> 01:16:04,440
to Alexander the military and

1860
01:16:08,870 --> 01:16:06,239
intelligence agencies were still scared

1861
01:16:11,149 --> 01:16:08,880
by the excesses of MK Ultra the infamous

1862
01:16:14,510 --> 01:16:11,159
CIA program that involved in part

1863
01:16:16,669 --> 01:16:14,520
slipping LSD to unsuspecting victims

1864
01:16:18,470 --> 01:16:16,679
quote until recently anything that smack

1865
01:16:20,930 --> 01:16:18,480
the Mind Control was extremely dangerous

1866
01:16:23,630 --> 01:16:20,940
because Congress would simply take the

1867
01:16:25,850 --> 01:16:23,640
money away he said Alexander

1868
01:16:27,530 --> 01:16:25,860
acknowledged that there were some abuses

1869
01:16:29,209 --> 01:16:27,540
that took place but added that on the

1870
01:16:31,430 --> 01:16:29,219
whole I would argue that we threw the

1871
01:16:33,430 --> 01:16:31,440
baby out with the bath water

1872
01:16:37,070 --> 01:16:33,440
but and here's the important part

1873
01:16:39,050 --> 01:16:37,080
September 11 2001 changed the mood in

1874
01:16:41,209 --> 01:16:39,060
Washington and some in the National

1875
01:16:43,729 --> 01:16:41,219
Security Community are again expressing

1876
01:16:46,130 --> 01:16:43,739
interest in mind control particularly a

1877
01:16:48,470 --> 01:16:46,140
younger generation of officials who

1878
01:16:49,610 --> 01:16:48,480
weren't around for Mk Ultra it's it's

1879
01:16:52,729 --> 01:16:49,620
interesting that it's coming back

1880
01:16:54,290 --> 01:16:52,739
Alexander observed while Alexander skoff

1881
01:16:56,090 --> 01:16:54,300
at the notion that he is somehow part of

1882
01:16:58,250 --> 01:16:56,100
an elaborate plot to control people's

1883
01:16:59,930 --> 01:16:58,260
minds he acknowledges support for

1884
01:17:01,490 --> 01:16:59,940
learning how to tap into a potential

1885
01:17:03,950 --> 01:17:01,500
enemy's brain

1886
01:17:05,689 --> 01:17:03,960
skipping down in the article Alexander

1887
01:17:07,550 --> 01:17:05,699
also is intrigued by the possibility of

1888
01:17:10,070 --> 01:17:07,560
using electronic means to modify

1889
01:17:12,890 --> 01:17:10,080
Behavior The Dilemma of the war on

1890
01:17:15,110 --> 01:17:12,900
terrorism he notes is that it never ends

1891
01:17:17,090 --> 01:17:15,120
so what do you do with enemies such as

1892
01:17:19,790 --> 01:17:17,100
those at Guantanamo keep them there

1893
01:17:21,709 --> 01:17:19,800
forever that's impractical behavior

1894
01:17:24,350 --> 01:17:21,719
modification could be an alternative he

1895
01:17:26,570 --> 01:17:24,360
says maybe I can fix you or

1896
01:17:28,850 --> 01:17:26,580
electronically neuter you so it's safer

1897
01:17:30,470 --> 01:17:28,860
so it's safe to release you into society

1898
01:17:33,110 --> 01:17:30,480
so you won't come back and kill me

1899
01:17:35,030 --> 01:17:33,120
Alexander says it's only a matter of

1900
01:17:37,370 --> 01:17:35,040
time before technology allows that

1901
01:17:39,470 --> 01:17:37,380
scenario to come truly continues we're

1902
01:17:40,910 --> 01:17:39,480
now getting to where we can do that he

1903
01:17:42,770 --> 01:17:40,920
pauses for a moment to take a bite of

1904
01:17:44,689 --> 01:17:42,780
his sandwich where does that fall in the

1905
01:17:46,310 --> 01:17:44,699
Epic Spectrum that's a really tough

1906
01:17:47,090 --> 01:17:46,320
question

1907
01:17:50,209 --> 01:17:47,100
um

1908
01:17:52,189 --> 01:17:50,219
so it's interesting that he says here uh

1909
01:17:55,010 --> 01:17:52,199
that the mood in Washington changed

1910
01:17:57,470 --> 01:17:55,020
right after 9 11 and suddenly they were

1911
01:17:59,709 --> 01:17:57,480
more open to considering these

1912
01:18:02,030 --> 01:17:59,719
non-lethal weapons these mind control

1913
01:18:04,130 --> 01:18:02,040
Technologies because I've talked to so

1914
01:18:06,169 --> 01:18:04,140
many people Damian's experiences starts

1915
01:18:08,330 --> 01:18:06,179
in the summer 2003.

1916
01:18:09,649 --> 01:18:08,340
right after 9 11. I've talked to a lot

1917
01:18:11,990 --> 01:18:09,659
of other people who have the same

1918
01:18:16,910 --> 01:18:12,000
experience where they're Tech well their

1919
01:18:21,950 --> 01:18:19,250
uh I spoke to someone who worked at the

1920
01:18:23,689 --> 01:18:21,960
ranch for uh six years

1921
01:18:26,750 --> 01:18:23,699
Skinwalker Ranch

1922
01:18:28,370 --> 01:18:26,760
and he said that he was convinced that

1923
01:18:30,470 --> 01:18:28,380
everything he'd seen was of a

1924
01:18:32,689 --> 01:18:30,480
supernatural origin

1925
01:18:36,169 --> 01:18:32,699
but I spoke to him for about two hours

1926
01:18:38,149 --> 01:18:36,179
in October of 2020 he had just read

1927
01:18:39,950 --> 01:18:38,159
camellio and he said after reading

1928
01:18:42,410 --> 01:18:39,960
camellio everything that I described

1929
01:18:46,550 --> 01:18:42,420
there he had seen on the ranch

1930
01:18:48,830 --> 01:18:46,560
and he said he thought that Skinwalker

1931
01:18:51,290 --> 01:18:48,840
Ranch was quote a man-made operation

1932
01:18:54,050 --> 01:18:51,300
duplicating Native American lore for

1933
01:18:56,510 --> 01:18:54,060
plausible deniability to cover up for

1934
01:18:59,270 --> 01:18:56,520
these experiments in exotic technology

1935
01:19:00,890 --> 01:18:59,280
and uh he described seeing an old man

1936
01:19:02,450 --> 01:19:00,900
turn into a wolf right in front of his

1937
01:19:05,330 --> 01:19:02,460
eyes

1938
01:19:09,410 --> 01:19:05,340
um and he believed that was a product of

1939
01:19:12,770 --> 01:19:09,420
the optical camouflage technology

1940
01:19:14,870 --> 01:19:12,780
um and he also talked a lot about uh

1941
01:19:16,610 --> 01:19:14,880
a lot of cancer fatalities in the area

1942
01:19:18,770 --> 01:19:16,620
where the Skinwalker Ranch is located

1943
01:19:20,270 --> 01:19:18,780
and he believes that was connected to

1944
01:19:22,250 --> 01:19:20,280
the experiments going on there so I

1945
01:19:24,890 --> 01:19:22,260
don't know you know I don't know

1946
01:19:26,510 --> 01:19:24,900
um uh if he was um

1947
01:19:28,490 --> 01:19:26,520
hospital that he was

1948
01:19:31,729 --> 01:19:28,500
feeding me a lime

1949
01:19:34,010 --> 01:19:31,739
I know I don't know he did but he I I do

1950
01:19:35,990 --> 01:19:34,020
know that he actually did work there and

1951
01:19:38,630 --> 01:19:36,000
he

1952
01:19:41,630 --> 01:19:38,640
um sincerely seemed to believe

1953
01:19:45,290 --> 01:19:41,640
that the the camellio

1954
01:19:47,510 --> 01:19:45,300
um reframed his experiences because he

1955
01:19:50,930 --> 01:19:47,520
said that everything that Damian

1956
01:19:52,430 --> 01:19:50,940
experienced he had experienced

1957
01:19:55,430 --> 01:19:52,440
um

1958
01:19:58,490 --> 01:19:55,440
and you know this this kind of

1959
01:20:01,790 --> 01:19:58,500
fixing the people that John Alexander

1960
01:20:04,970 --> 01:20:01,800
mentioned it sounds very similar to Jose

1961
01:20:07,729 --> 01:20:04,980
Delgado who uh the Spanish would step

1962
01:20:10,250 --> 01:20:07,739
into the Spanish bull ring with mind

1963
01:20:12,830 --> 01:20:10,260
control devices and he was also if I'm

1964
01:20:14,750 --> 01:20:12,840
not mistaken uh involved with

1965
01:20:17,270 --> 01:20:14,760
intelligence

1966
01:20:20,149 --> 01:20:17,280
well yes I in fact uh this this little

1967
01:20:23,450 --> 01:20:20,159
detail I'll give you now I wish I I was

1968
01:20:26,630 --> 01:20:23,460
aware of this back in 2003 but Jose

1969
01:20:28,790 --> 01:20:26,640
Delgado I knew who he was uh I had read

1970
01:20:31,910 --> 01:20:28,800
the physical control of the mind because

1971
01:20:33,890 --> 01:20:31,920
of because I knew Walterboro

1972
01:20:37,130 --> 01:20:33,900
uh physical control line was the book

1973
01:20:38,930 --> 01:20:37,140
that Delgado wrote back in six seven I

1974
01:20:43,870 --> 01:20:38,940
think or 69.

1975
01:20:48,470 --> 01:20:43,880
and uh Delgado was a Spanish scientist

1976
01:20:50,510 --> 01:20:48,480
who uh in the 50s had made headlines

1977
01:20:52,910 --> 01:20:50,520
because he pulled a stunt

1978
01:20:54,890 --> 01:20:52,920
where he got into a bull ring of course

1979
01:20:57,350 --> 01:20:54,900
it's Spain so the ultimate you know

1980
01:20:59,990 --> 01:20:57,360
symbol of machismo is getting into a

1981
01:21:02,090 --> 01:21:00,000
ring with a bull right he got into the

1982
01:21:06,530 --> 01:21:02,100
ring and he

1983
01:21:10,070 --> 01:21:06,540
uh he had cracked the skull the uh of

1984
01:21:13,010 --> 01:21:10,080
the bull open and put in an implant and

1985
01:21:15,410 --> 01:21:13,020
he got into the ring with the red cape

1986
01:21:17,630 --> 01:21:15,420
and then behind the red cape he had this

1987
01:21:19,850 --> 01:21:17,640
control remote control box

1988
01:21:22,610 --> 01:21:19,860
and he was able to make the ball move

1989
01:21:25,010 --> 01:21:22,620
backwards and forwards with this remote

1990
01:21:28,610 --> 01:21:25,020
control box

1991
01:21:31,070 --> 01:21:28,620
well so he he was able to you know

1992
01:21:33,410 --> 01:21:31,080
defeat the ball not with a sword but

1993
01:21:36,530 --> 01:21:33,420
with this uh mind control technology

1994
01:21:39,290 --> 01:21:36,540
that caught the eye of the CIA

1995
01:21:40,970 --> 01:21:39,300
um they recruited Delgado brought him

1996
01:21:43,610 --> 01:21:40,980
over the United States gave him a cushy

1997
01:21:48,490 --> 01:21:43,620
post at Yale where he proceeded to

1998
01:21:54,130 --> 01:21:51,290
psychological uh you know female

1999
01:21:57,590 --> 01:21:54,140
patients psych wards he would instill

2000
01:21:59,810 --> 01:21:57,600
orgasms in them from afar

2001
01:22:03,290 --> 01:21:59,820
um he would do experiments with uh

2002
01:22:06,770 --> 01:22:03,300
making your one pupil dilate and the

2003
01:22:08,810 --> 01:22:06,780
other one not dilate uh with the same

2004
01:22:10,930 --> 01:22:08,820
sort of Technology

2005
01:22:14,149 --> 01:22:10,940
um he experimented on children

2006
01:22:16,310 --> 01:22:14,159
on prisoners

2007
01:22:18,290 --> 01:22:16,320
and all this was for what he called the

2008
01:22:21,229 --> 01:22:18,300
psycho-civilization of society we're

2009
01:22:24,410 --> 01:22:21,239
talking you know A Clockwork Orange

2010
01:22:26,930 --> 01:22:24,420
kind of scenario here

2011
01:22:32,209 --> 01:22:26,940
um and Ed Delgado

2012
01:22:37,270 --> 01:22:32,219
uh who worked on mkl trip he retired

2013
01:22:42,410 --> 01:22:37,280
and uh where he retired to was San Diego

2014
01:22:45,410 --> 01:22:42,420
he was living in the same area as Damien

2015
01:22:47,149 --> 01:22:45,420
in 2003 when all this happened I did not

2016
01:22:50,450 --> 01:22:47,159
know that at the time I didn't know it

2017
01:22:52,669 --> 01:22:50,460
until 2011 when Delgado died his

2018
01:22:54,770 --> 01:22:52,679
obituary was in the LA times and I was

2019
01:22:58,550 --> 01:22:54,780
reading it and at the end it said he

2020
01:23:01,250 --> 01:22:58,560
retired to Sunny San Diego and lived

2021
01:23:04,070 --> 01:23:01,260
like the last decade of his life there

2022
01:23:06,490 --> 01:23:04,080
uh supposedly in retirement

2023
01:23:10,370 --> 01:23:06,500
but maybe he was still having some fun

2024
01:23:12,169 --> 01:23:10,380
uh in Southern California

2025
01:23:13,850 --> 01:23:12,179
unbelievable that was kind of an amazing

2026
01:23:16,910 --> 01:23:13,860
Revelation when I came up just stumbled

2027
01:23:19,250 --> 01:23:16,920
across that in his in his obit

2028
01:23:21,830 --> 01:23:19,260
the synchronicities talk about Delgado

2029
01:23:23,630 --> 01:23:21,840
and uh in my first book cryptocatology

2030
01:23:25,250 --> 01:23:23,640
there's a chapter in there called honey

2031
01:23:28,490 --> 01:23:25,260
did you leave your brain back at Langley

2032
01:23:33,110 --> 01:23:28,500
again uh and I I talk about

2033
01:23:35,270 --> 01:23:33,120
uh Delgado in in that book and um uh

2034
01:23:37,189 --> 01:23:35,280
it's another book worth reading is Tom

2035
01:23:40,310 --> 01:23:37,199
O'Neill's chaos

2036
01:23:43,450 --> 01:23:40,320
which is all about Charles Manson

2037
01:23:46,850 --> 01:23:43,460
Delgado and his fellow

2038
01:23:48,070 --> 01:23:46,860
CIA MK Ultra scientists like Louis giant

2039
01:23:51,110 --> 01:23:48,080
West

2040
01:23:54,350 --> 01:23:51,120
who worked at UCLA

2041
01:23:55,729 --> 01:23:54,360
they they pop up in the book chaos which

2042
01:24:01,189 --> 01:23:55,739
I

2043
01:24:03,470 --> 01:24:01,199
overlaps with Camellia and in many weird

2044
01:24:05,990 --> 01:24:03,480
ways and that's where I got the

2045
01:24:07,669 --> 01:24:06,000
information of Delgado was your work

2046
01:24:10,490 --> 01:24:07,679
um Robert I've had some conversations

2047
01:24:12,709 --> 01:24:10,500
with retired CIA officer Mike Baker and

2048
01:24:15,110 --> 01:24:12,719
he's gone into great detail about the

2049
01:24:16,729 --> 01:24:15,120
realities of this non-lethal weaponry

2050
01:24:19,370 --> 01:24:16,739
and I'm telling you I'm becoming a

2051
01:24:21,770 --> 01:24:19,380
Believer man I'm sorry for keeping you

2052
01:24:24,410 --> 01:24:21,780
longer than expected um can't thank you

2053
01:24:26,930 --> 01:24:24,420
enough for coming on the podcast can you

2054
01:24:29,630 --> 01:24:26,940
tell listeners where's the best place to

2055
01:24:31,310 --> 01:24:29,640
buy your books which are genius and

2056
01:24:33,290 --> 01:24:31,320
where to get more of the amazing

2057
01:24:35,090 --> 01:24:33,300
research and literature that is Robert

2058
01:24:38,689 --> 01:24:35,100
Guffey

2059
01:24:40,870 --> 01:24:38,699
uh well I'm constantly updating all

2060
01:24:43,970 --> 01:24:40,880
these things on crypto

2061
01:24:46,390 --> 01:24:43,980
scatology.com uh

2062
01:24:47,870 --> 01:24:46,400
[Music]

2063
01:24:50,330 --> 01:24:47,880
c-r-y-p-t-o-s-c-a-t-o-l-o-g-y that's a

2064
01:24:52,790 --> 01:24:50,340
word I made up crypto Latin for secret

2065
01:24:54,649 --> 01:24:52,800
scatology is the study of so you

2066
01:24:57,350 --> 01:24:54,659
put together a study of secret

2067
01:25:00,709 --> 01:24:57,360
which is what I do and that's what my

2068
01:25:04,550 --> 01:25:00,719
first book is about uh and all my books

2069
01:25:07,070 --> 01:25:04,560
uh Camelio operation mind spies and

2070
01:25:10,310 --> 01:25:07,080
saucers uh the fiction I've written

2071
01:25:12,050 --> 01:25:10,320
until last dog dies uh

2072
01:25:14,110 --> 01:25:12,060
um I have I have a novel coming out soon

2073
01:25:17,030 --> 01:25:14,120
called Dead monkey rum which is a

2074
01:25:19,729 --> 01:25:17,040
cryptozoological fantasy based on the

2075
01:25:21,290 --> 01:25:19,739
the bizarre theories of stanislosikovski

2076
01:25:24,290 --> 01:25:21,300
that's coming out from planet Bizarro

2077
01:25:27,169 --> 01:25:24,300
press in England uh very soon uh all

2078
01:25:29,689 --> 01:25:27,179
these books uh are or will be available

2079
01:25:31,310 --> 01:25:29,699
on Amazon

2080
01:25:32,450 --> 01:25:31,320
um if you want to get Camellia directly

2081
01:25:35,689 --> 01:25:32,460
from the publisher you can go to

2082
01:25:37,610 --> 01:25:35,699
orbooks.com or b-o-o-k-s and you can get

2083
01:25:40,010 --> 01:25:37,620
Camellia there and also my latest book

2084
01:25:42,470 --> 01:25:40,020
operation mindfuck is also published by

2085
01:25:44,810 --> 01:25:42,480
by or books

2086
01:25:49,010 --> 01:25:44,820
um and uh

2087
01:25:52,490 --> 01:25:49,020
yeah yeah uh so uh Amazon all my books

2088
01:25:55,070 --> 01:25:52,500
are there thank you so much thank you

2089
01:25:57,350 --> 01:25:55,080
well if that wasn't fun and Illuminating

2090
01:26:00,709 --> 01:25:57,360
I don't know what is one of my favorite

2091
01:26:03,890 --> 01:26:00,719
authors one of my favorite topics one of

2092
01:26:06,110 --> 01:26:03,900
the best books I've ever read and one of

2093
01:26:07,550 --> 01:26:06,120
the most amazing Stories I think anybody

2094
01:26:11,270 --> 01:26:07,560
has ever heard

2095
01:26:14,110 --> 01:26:11,280
keep up with all things Robert Guffey at

2096
01:26:17,209 --> 01:26:14,120
his crypto

2097
01:26:19,910 --> 01:26:17,219
scatology.blogspot.com website and check

2098
01:26:21,229 --> 01:26:19,920
out all of the books by Robert Guffey on

2099
01:26:24,590 --> 01:26:21,239
Amazon

2100
01:26:28,129 --> 01:26:24,600
a treasure Trove of literature and

2101
01:26:30,530 --> 01:26:28,139
research and conspiracy until next time

2102
01:26:32,810 --> 01:26:30,540
keep your eyes to the skies feet on the

2103
01:26:43,970 --> 01:26:32,820
ground but don't forget to take a look

2104
01:26:43,980 --> 01:26:49,750
[Music]